AIBU to think a junior probationer’s month abroad request is unreasonable?

[estrogone]

We have a junior in our office who’s only been with us about three months and is still on probation, where the expectation is mostly office-based work. They briefly mentioned in passing at one point that they might travel overseas, but there was never any proper discussion or approval before the trip was booked.

They’ve now come back and advised the trip is already booked and confirmed for nearly a month overseas, in a time zone 10 hours away. They proposed a range of adjusted working arrangements, including shortened hours and overnight work, so they can continue working remotely while away.

I haven’t approved the shortened hours or alternative arrangements and have asked them to demonstrate how they realistically intend to maintain service levels and cope with working nights while effectively on holiday overseas.

I am a lot WTAF to four weeks of leave for someone who has only been with the business a matter of months and is still in probation.

AIBU to think this is request is out of order?

Well that seems insane. A simple 'no' should suffice.

I’d be declining as that’s ridiculous to just book it.

The trip is booked and paid for so they are not going to cancel it.

You need to decide if sacking them and starting recruitment training over again is more of a hassle than a month's sub par performance. Only you know your job well enough to answer that.

It is a bit CF of them to do it, but it's done now so it's down to how you respond.

Well if it doesn't work it doesn't work. In this circumstance I'd tell them to take leave for the 4 weeks (either paid or unpaid) and then extend probation by a month to cover the absence

Does your company/organisation permit remote working from abroad?

Does sound like s/he is taking the proverbial.

As above, either tell them to resign, or take unpaid leave for 4 weeks and extend probation. And tell them that holidays need to be cleared in advance in all jobs unless declared as pre-booked when starting a new job.

I’m very pro remote work. But a new staff member spending 4 weeks working in a different time zone to their colleagues? That’s not reasonable.
Why aren’t they asking to take it as leave?

Do they need to take company owned technology ( laptop, smartphone ) with them, and what is the policy around that - will it work, will if cost money?

Where are they going and are there tax / visa implications of them working there?

Ill-thought out and naive. And would it set a precedent?

But the precedent being set here is crazy. Both for this individual and other employees who might want to do the same thing. You can't just book a month abroad without getting that properly approved.

Yes this. Our's doesn't due to cyber security concerns

I would be wtaf and say no way unless they were pretty fucking special and there was no chance or recruiting a similar candidate.

How far in advance is the trip? Will they have completed probation and how are they doing in general? Is there anything in their contract about office attendance or working overseas? Do they deal with anything of a confidential nature?

Agree with above posters. Either sack him or her or tell them to take as leave. Working in a different time zone for weeks at a time would be unacceptable in most jobs even for someone who has been there years, never mind anew starter.

I am keen for a range of opinions, hence the AIBU.

It is a client facing role, assigned to one client so I leaves the business exposed. I am considering getting in a temp but the.person only has a few days leave accrued. Perhaps 5 working days of the 17 working days requested. So I am thinking to say take the balance unpaid. They just won't be able to work full nights on holiday, will they?

The first response is ‘You should ensure all leave requests are approved before you book anything.’

The second response is: ‘A destination 10 hours away isn’t compatible with our service hours. And we wouldn’t approve working overseas except in exceptional circumstances and if it met the needs of the business.’ Quote relevant IT security policy as needed.

Their options are:
Cancel the trip
Take the trip either as paid or unpaid leave.

And absolutely extend their probation by the month. They don’t seem to understand how work ‘works’ yet!

Just say no?
Honestly, I’m worried for this country with attitudes towards work like this.

This. If they've been a valuable employee in the short time they've been with you so far, offer a month's unpaid exceptional leave if this is something your company can accommodate, but be very clear that this is a highly unusual privilege and 1) won't happen again and 2) probation is put on ice until they're back, the month does not check off a month of probation.

The exceptional working arrangements don't sound workable for a junior employee who has only been at the company three months, especially given the ten hour time difference.

They are due to leave in 4 weeks time.

I reckon this person will be difficult to manage in the long run.

I'd tell them that it was very unprofessional of them to book leave without clearing it first. So no, I cannot facilitate a month out of work as you suggest, it is not practical or good for our business.

Would you like to cancel or leave? Otherwise I will have to terminate your employment (it's within the period when it can be done without fear of tribunals!)

Otherwise if you don't want confrontation, I'd let them go and terminate at the six month end of probation.

I think you are mad to be even considering it.

Was there any discussion at interview..a lot of organisations honour holiday already booked prior to the job offer?

Working while away is usually a non-runner for a junior, and let's face it isn't really going to be particularly successful if they're travelling. Depending on the job role and discussion at interview it's either unpaid leave or resignation.

Do they understand that that isn’t how this works? They have to book annual leave if they want to go away. They can’t just say “I’ll be working from abroad” and tell you the required adjustments.

Have you not said to them, “I don’t think you’re clearly understanding employment. If you want to go away then you need to request annual leave, and wait for it to be approved. You cannot work from abroad on your own terms whilst having a holiday.”

They sound like they’re going to be trouble, so fail their probation and get rid.

It's ridiculous to me you or her are even thinking about how she could do the work remotely from her holiday?! It's clearly a holiday and needs to be treated as such. You can refuse her the leave. But the notion it could be a remote working arrangement is utter pie in the sky.

I am tempted to hard arse it, but they are 25 and would lose thousands.

Absolutely agree with you though about the entitlement. To be honest I feel quite bloody minded a out it, but keeping to myself as it won't be professional to go postal about it.

Unless this was prebooked before their interview… not a chance!

Suggesting to work remotely whilst on holiday is entitled and risks security… do they have a private place to work etc?

I’d say they can take it unpaid but their probation will be extended to account for the time not working.