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Feminism: Sex & gender discussions

Isn't the name of Mumsnet itself sexist?

313 replies

MissPeach · 09/05/2013 16:17

The Mumsnet slogan is 'By parents for parents', suggesting that it is of course, for mothers and fathers. Yet the name Mumsnet would suggest otherwise. It suggests that the forum is only for women, which in turn conveys the idea that women do more parenting than men.

To be honest, it doesn't irk me that much, but it was just a thought I randomly had, and was wondering other opinions on it.

OP posts:
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Roshbegosh · 09/05/2013 16:21

Women do more parenting than men, don't they? You have a point but I like the site being more for women than men.

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ItsYonliMe · 09/05/2013 16:23

For gawd's sake. Will it make you happier to call it dadsnet?

Do you have anything with anymore substance about it to concern your little head about?

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AMumInScotland · 09/05/2013 16:34

It is mainly for mums. It is also (secondarily) for and about parents. It (thirdly) also welcomes members who are not female and/or not parents. I don't see anything inherently sexist about something being aimed more at one gender than the other. It doesn't state or imply that fathers are less important, or that they are necessarily less involved in parenting. It is just labelled in a way that makes it clear it is a predominantly female-aimed forum. Nowt wrong with that, IMHO.

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SPsCliffingAllOverMN · 09/05/2013 16:35

It should be Humansnet but then the Aliens would get offended

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wannabedomesticgoddess · 09/05/2013 16:38

No I dont believe it is.

Its aimed at women. Just as some websites are aimed at men. It doesnt lessen the value of dads.

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anklebitersmum · 09/05/2013 16:41

I vote for 'Parental-unitnet'.

Covers all the mum/dad/step/foster bases and doesn't insult aliens Grin

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SPsCliffingAllOverMN · 09/05/2013 16:42

Or maybe just Everyone/Everything UnitNet'

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LineRunner · 09/05/2013 16:50

TitNet

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thecatfromjapan · 09/05/2013 16:50

Since the majority of parenting is actually done by women - "mothers" -naming a parenting website in a "gender neutral" way would actually have been deeply sexist. Like taking an eraser and rubbing a fact out. Not neutral at all, in fact. A pretend neutrality.

It also flags up that this - massively successful - site was established by women - mothers - how cool is that!

I am really perplexed by how you intend this phrase: "It suggests that the forum is only for women, which in turn conveys the idea that women do more parenting than men."

There is the teeniest implication in there, though perhaps I am misreading you, that it might be incorrect or wrong in some way to convey the idea that women do more parenting than men.
I am genuinely interested in your further thoughts on that.

I'm quite an old lady now, and have been pondering gender and parenting for quite a few of my years. I've reached this conclusion: while there may well be no biological determination to parenting roles, if we look at social roles in the UK, as they currently stand, and analyse the meaning of parenting on a statistical basis, we would be forced to conclude there is a gender dimension to the meaning of parenting. Parenting gendered female, carried out by women in the main, we might call mothering, and the people (actually, women) doing it, we might call mothers. Likewise, we could call the gendered- male counterpart, fathering, carried out by those persons with the biological sex of men mainly, and called fathers. The mothers role tends to be a bit more "present" and involve day to day care - physical and emotional - of the children. On a statistical basis. That is, on a majority basis, at the moment. Male parenting, fathering, at present, in the majority of cases, looks rather different.

We might not feel that the above is ideal. We may work in our own private spheres to alter/modify this. But I think it's a pretty fair summing up of how things stand at present.

Now, given this current set up, isn't there something a leetle weird about people trying to insist that with weasel words you gloss over that?

And I will put my cards on the table here -- I have a sneaky suspicion that one or two chaps are fucking seething - with the rage of those who feel their entitlement to own the whole of the world has been infringed - every time they see the word "mum" in mumsnet. They are furious at the success of this site. And they are furious that it proudly proclaims the presence of not just women, but mothers.

Remember, people feel quite oddly about mothers. Quite a lot of "people" (see what I did there?) feel quite oddly about women.* But you can cube that oddness when it comes to mothers.

*Just look at some of the new stories we've enjoyed this week.

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thecatfromjapan · 09/05/2013 16:52

I think we should informally call it "Cuntsnet" and reclaim the word cunts.

"Mumsnet: For uncuntrollable women."

Or something.

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LineRunner · 09/05/2013 16:56

thecatfromjapan I like your big post. And your little post as well.

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TeiTetua · 09/05/2013 17:20

Isn't the name of Mumsnet itself sexist?

Yes. But its operation isn't, so it's fine. And if the name were Dadsnet and it clearly welcomed everyone, it would be just as good.

Though actually by being Mumsnet, we read it as being clearly about parenting, whereas if it were Dadsnet, we'd be more likely to see it as appealing to a minority within parents as a group (ha ha, take that you Marxists) and I doubt if many women would actually participate.

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BasilBabyEater · 09/05/2013 19:49

Love Catfromjapan's post.

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Ilikethebreeze · 09/05/2013 22:21

Yes.
It is not really welcoming to dads at all, because there is a dadsnet section. But anything that dads post on there comes through on here. But everything on here does not go through to dadsnet.
But I get the impression that that is what MN wants it like.
And probably most MNetters as well.
Personally I would welcome many more dads on here, but I would guess that I am in the minority on that one.
Actually I get the impression that MN does not want more dads on here, but I could be wrong.

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TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 10/05/2013 00:48

Eh? Men and women can post in any section.

How do you feel about Mothercare, ilike?

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Snazzynewyear · 10/05/2013 00:59

Yes, let's make sure the place welcomes men in to exactly the same degree as women, since across the vast range of the rest of the internet, men have nowhere else to go and no material aimed at meeting their needs. Poor discriminated against bunch that they are.

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Snazzynewyear · 10/05/2013 01:01

Also, I assume the same righteous dissatisfaction is going to be directed at Men's Health, Women's Own etc.

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Ilikethebreeze · 10/05/2013 07:27

Good points.
Maybe I am wrong in that case.

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AMumInScotland · 10/05/2013 11:05

"Dadsnet" is just one topic on here, like "Relationships" or "Childbirth" - posting in one doesn't bar you from the rest, it just allows for one area of interest to be identified. So if "dads" (or anyone else) wants to discuss something that is likely to be specifically relevant to fathers then they put it there. For instance, they might want to talk about the practicalities of public toilets and changing rooms with daughters, which might get lost in "Chat" with lots of "mums" joining in to moan about toilet provision in general rather than stay focussed on the particular worries which men might have.

Men do pop up all over the place, and join in with pretty much any topic. I'd hope they would be cautious in areas like childbirth or breastfeeding, and make it clear they happen to be male if they want to join in, just as I'd be cautious joining in a conversation about prostate cancer on another forum.

But they are not unwelcome here, unless they individually behave in ways which go against the ethos of the site.

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TrampyPants · 10/05/2013 11:11

well, if it was called parentsnet, that would discriminate against non-parents.

I know, lets call it ParentsParentsToBeAndPeopleWhoJustLikeGabbingToLikemindedSouls-net.

I fixed the internet!

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StickyProblem · 10/05/2013 11:17

Well said catfromjapan

OP you do realise men are pretty well running the planet? Remove the plank of anti-women sexism before you solve the speck of dust that is anti-men.

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OrangeLily · 10/05/2013 11:52

Trampypants has indeed fixed the Internet.

I like the vibe here, it's funny and interesting and downright rude and silly sometimes.

It's also quite often the first website that pops up under questions I giggle and that's how I found it.

I'm not a parent, I would like to be but hasn't happened yet. I love that Mumsnet seems to bring out a brilliant side to women that I haven't seen elsewhere in the media.

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WilsonFrickett · 10/05/2013 12:08

I like that it's a female space. OK, men can join in, but it's overwhelmingly female and therefore refreshingly free of the gendered-based trolling that happens everywhere else in the web.

By which I don't mean the site doesn't get trolled, or that members don't troll in responses to OP's, but the particularly nasty reaches of 'shut up cunts' doesn't tend to happen here. (Here being MN, not FWR)

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Sunnywithshowers · 10/05/2013 12:22

It was started by two mums. So the title isn't sexist.

There are lots of men on here.

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vesuvia · 10/05/2013 12:42

A website named something like www.only.mothers.are.real.parents.so.no.fathers.allowed.com would be sexist, because it would discriminate against men who are parents. Mumsnet does not come anywhere close to that.

I wonder if Mumsnet chose their name because there may already have been a website called Parentsnet?

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