I need advice quickly please - Police involved with DS1

[needtodecide]

First the background

In 2008 Ds1 started stealing from us, only little things at first then they got bigger culminating in taking my bank card on our holidays and withdrawing £300. We contacted the police and a very nice community officer came round and spoke to him and he promised to stop and get a part time job. (he is 16)

Things got better for a while but over the last few weeks he has been horrible to live with and things were going missign again, a tenner from his siters purse, pound coins from mine, then last Thursday a bottle of vodka that was dd's went missing and so did he, he came in very drunk and denying that he had taken it. She waited until he had gone to bed, went in his room and got his phone, thinking if he had taken it there would be texts about it. She was right but there were also texts on about him getting weed from a dealer and passing it on to people at college. We challenged him about it, and he was upset but evasive - he doesn't knwo who he gets it from, he doesn't pay for it (!!). We contacted the same officer, asked him to visit us and have got this from him

"Given XXXXX has been in possession of cannabis and is a juvenile the only way he can be dealt with is by way of arrest. This would mean him coming into the station to be dealt with with yourself (i wouldn't propose the humiliation of him being placed in the rear of a liveried van.) You may wish to speak with your wife to see if this is the method you wish for him. I feel just "telling him off" would have the same effect as the previous talking to i gave him i.e. nothing ! He would probably receive a caution for this possession but this appears to be a small part of a very big jigsaw. If somebody is selling cannabis to schoolchildren then this person needs to be taken out too something which can only be done with XXXX's help."

I feel sick.

what would you do?

And answers to questions you may ask - he doesn't have a job, he wouldn't get one as it would "eat into his free time", he gets no money at all from us other than busfare to college - if he won't get a job, I will not fund a social life. We have confiscated his phone, he doesn't have a lap top/x box/ psp/ playsytation/tv.

[RonaldMcDonald]

Be aware that if he is getting weed from a dealer and "passing it on" he will be classed as dealing by the police
that is a very different kettle of fish

[needtodecide]

They have said 'a caution', does anyone know exactly what this implies?

[pottycock]

A caution means a formal caution but not being charged I don't think.

In your position I would do it - it sounds like this is only one symptom of the way he seems to be going, so an early attempt to shock him into realising the implications of what he is doing might help him in the long run.

What a hard decision for you to have to make.

[GypsyMoth]

you need to nip it in the bud...definitely. take him in...deal with it,though i think(not sure here) a caution will be on his record. however,better that than him ending up a drug addict.

he's 16. are jobs plentiful in your area for 16 year olds? as i know my own teenagers are struggling to find any jobs at all. its hard enough for adults with experience.

[posieparker]

Why don't you speak to frank they may suggest some intervention that won't include any criminal record or DNA being swabbed.

[needtodecide]

I'm know that I have to do it, I jsut don't wnat to stand at the side of my little boy (he's bigger than me but you knwo what I mean) while he is arrested.

I have to do it because he has a younger brother and so he can't be seen to get away with it.

Oh shit

Tiffany - If he tried to look for a job, I would be pleased, there are plenty he could appply for Mcd's KFC, Burger King etc, but he jsut won't.

[brimfull]

Tough love. I think it's the best thing for him.
Good luck iwht it.

[pottycock]

I agree talking to Frank would be helpful...this just sounds like the start of a long sad story so now is probably your chance to deal with it robustly and positively. Is there anything in your area he could engage with? Would he do some volunteering if he's unemployed?

[TidyBush]

He needs to be made to realise just how serious this is - a caution is basically him admitting what he's done and getting a more formal telling off than before. BUT, a caution will stay on his record so that if in years to come he works in job that requires a CRB check this will show up and could affect his abiltiy to work in certain roles.

Good luck.

[posieparker]

I would seek out teen camps or voluntary work for him to see how the other half live. Only as a last resort would I choose the Police to deal with one of my children.

[LoveBeingAMummy]

If he is saying he is not getting paid for it than the only thing i can think of is that he is selling it on in return for getting his free.

He needs to understadn how serious this is. I can't tell you whether to take him to the police tbh. I really don't know if i would.

[ktbeau]

Teenagers need money in order to socialise. If you don't give him any, he will steal/deal drugs/whatever in order to fund his social life.

Why not ask him honestly why he has done it, if he needs money then help him find a job and agree to pay him an allowance for a limited time (3 months?) to tide him over. If he is in higher ed then he can claim an EMA (education maintenance allowance i think) for a few pounds a week.

I would only involve the police with my dc if a life was in danger.

You may push him away and at his age, his substitute family will be his friends/dealers etc.

Tell him your dilemma and how you feel about the situation without "blaming"

[needtodecide]

He can't claim EMA as our income is over £30k a year - £30k isn't a lot with a killer mortgage.

At the same age his sister was workign and so I gave her no spending money, if he tried to get a job he woud get spending money - not a lot but still a bit. It's the 'it will eat into my spare time ' thing thats wound us up - even his little brother has a paper round!

Anyhow, we have decided that we have to take him, we cannot be seen for the sake of the other children to condone this behaviour. Hopefully it will be the shock he nneds to make him think.

[posieparker]

Fucking hell, it's a bit of weed... and a lot of stupidity. I think taking him to the police is giving someone else the dirty work and giving up on him. This can affect the rest of his life. Seriously is this truly you only option?

[Tortington]

i wouldn't involve the police as eve a caution could affect his work chances.

you could talk to frank but IME they are a shower of shite.

you could also talk to parentline - again IME shower of shyte - but everyone is different.

you may also want to contact your local DRUG ACTION TEAM. here

you may want to take him to connections
to the local information shop
job centre.

i have recently become involved in a downward spiral of non productive shouting, negative sanctions etc culminating in ds2 going awol for 4 days and i got the police involved to look for him.

it was simply a spiral of anger from me which gave ds2 the knee jerk 'fuck you' reaction as is the want of teenagers!

we had a heart o heart - drawing a line under everything and drawing up some rules we both agreed with.

i did say to him " look son, we aren't keeping you here. Like your older brother, should you leave and ever want to come back hom even when you are 50, you will always be welcome ere, this is your home. but if you do want to stay here, we will have to do things in a way that as a parent i feel is right. If you don't want to stay, i'm not keeping you"

he stayed. so its about clear choices - the speech was a delicate 'my house my rules' speech but more diplomatic ( i think!)

If you don't have this kind of communication with your son - or don't feel it could work - you could also look into family counselling.

hth!

[thatsnotmymonster]

Very difficult. I would hesitate too before involving the police anymore. When I was 16 (and younger) it was very common for people I knew to have weed. I don't know where they got it from but it wasn't hard and someone always had some. I had it on a few occasions, I've never done any other drug.

Would it be better to try and talk very openly with him and maybe explain that what he is doing could result in a police caution which will stay on his record, that you have thought about taking him in to the station but that you really don't want to but you will if he doesn't change his behaviour and pull his finger out and get a job.

Not wanting to criticise but if he has no tv/phone/xbox and no money then I guess he is just totally bored and when kids are bored they hang out on the streets and drink etc. Maybe you could agree an incentive with him- like if he gets a job you will pay half towards a games console and he can have mates round on a weekend evening and a couple of beers (not sure if that's acceptable for 16yo? I only have pre-schoolers) but something like that?

Maybe I am way off as I don't have teenagers but all I know is I did those things at that age because my parents were so strict, I wasn't allowed any freedom, had early curfews, they were out of touch and I felt I couldn't talk to them.

[HeadlessLadyH]

OK, so this advice is from a LAWYERS perspective of getting the police involved, and not a mothers.

If your son was to be arrested, he would have the right to ask for a solicitor to advise him. If it t'were me, then my advice to him would be that there is no evidence of his possession of any drugs, nor any "passing on" (the text messages on his phone would probably not count as evidence for a variety of reasons), and that he should say nothing and he would walk out of the police station with out a caution or anything. So an arrest may not acheive anything except that he experiences a custody suite briefly. And if he gets arrested by pre arranged appointment, which is what the officer is suggesting, then he may not even go in a cell.

SHould he choose to admit having (ie possession alone and not the passing on which as someone else has pointed out would be viewed as supplying and ups the ante somewhat) the drugs however, the police probably would give him a reprimand ( the juvenile equivalent of a first time caution) and it would stay on his police national computer record for ever, but become spent when he reaches 18.

As a mother, I can't say what I would do in your shoes, but I really would think twice about an arrest at this stage. Good luck. for you.

[becstarlitsea]

Rather than calling the police in, I'd tend towards reaching out to him first. Is there an addaction in your area -

here

[needtodecide]

We have tried everythign to get him to get a job - we have said that if he gets one and holds it for 6 months we will give him £500 towards a scooter. He refuses - loud and long.

Yes, it's a bit of weed, but it's also stealing, drinking and lying. I have not given up on my son and never will, I hope that this is the jolt he needs to get sorted.

The reason he doesn't have a play station etc is that it was sold to pay off the money that he stole from us.

I felt crap about taking him to the police station, I now feel worse but also feel that I have tried everything. When you have a boy/man who is taller than you telling that you can't make him do anythning he doesn't wnat to, and you can't ground him as you can't keep him in you feel like a totally failed mother.

We have talked to him, oh how we have talked to him, we have talked to him about stealing, lying and his violent temper, we have told him what we will and won't tolerate, he has seen counsellors, i am at the end of my tether and I honestly don't know what else to do.

[needtodecide]

Last update before I go, the community officer who talked to Joe after the thefts has talked to dh, he is coming round tonight to take the weed off us and to talk to ds1, we can then discuss if we wnat to go down the road of an arrest and caution.

Thanks for your answers - even if I didn't like all of them!

Just need to remember to change my name back now.

[posieparker]

I can't imagine how hard your choices are, you have obviously reached the end of a very long tether. There's got to be something out there for kids to prevent them from continuing down the wrong path as opposed to punishing them once they reach a low point. Rehab?

Good Luck OP, i hope something gets through.

[PrincessBoo]

Hi,

Is there a YISP in your area? It stands for Youth Inclusion Support Panel and is the prevention side of the Youth Offending Service. I am a YISP key worker. We work with young people between the ages of 8 - 17 and the aim is to reduce the numbers of first time entrants into the youth justice system.

Allowing the officer to arrest and reprimand you son will go on his record - ask your CSO to perhaps implement an ABC with him (acceptable behaviour contract). If there is no YISP in your area is there anyone who can implement a CAF?

What is the young persons drug agency in your area called? Can you refer him to them?

[PrincessBoo]

Oh and just some extra info - young people usually get one or two reprimands - the they get what's called a final warning before they then get a court order and YRO (youth rehabiliation order).

Look here at the yjb website for more info.

Good luck with it all.