Advice needed on DD and school issues!

[lucydaniels4658]

Sorry in advance for rant !
My DD is 13 and at home she can be pretty challenging but I think no more than the usual teenager (my first teen!so can't be to sure!). She generally complies with the usual "gooddd your so unfair ,everyine else can do what they want" ,ranting and raving when cant get own way,glued to her mobile!,and has a tendency to sound like a broken record if she wants something or someones annoyed herect But on the other hand can be very sunny natured and a delight! She has always been a live wire and doesnt do down time she is always on the go and would be with her friends 24/7 if i let her she does lots of out of school activities .I am not concerned about the above what I am concerned about is school!
She is a completly different character at school and I am finding it soul destroying hearing so many negative things ! She has always struggled academically and does have additional learning needs but no statement . She has always had a very poor memory and found it hard to concentrate but since secondary she has become extremly challenging in the classroom setting . The teachers tell me she refuses additional support (she finds it embarassing being singled out or having resources!) ,she is disruptive ,never concentrates ,loses everything , forgets what shes doing is rude and is often so disruptive she is removed to work in iscolation as her behaviour prevents the others from working .Even in iscolation with a 1-1 she doesnt complete work and decides she cant do it before shes even seen what the task is . She has made no academic progress for ages ! I feel its down to low self esteem but school think its a bad attitude !They have reffered her to CAHMS who we are due to see soon!
I thought it was usually the other way round but she is lovely at home (unless homework needs doing!!) and the complete opposite at school !Gets on very well with my OH and isnt doing anything rebellious !
Has anyone had a similar situation?!

[MrsDavidBowie]

How do you deal with the bad behaviour at school? Do you talk to her...impose sanctions etc?

[lucydaniels4658]

She is sanctioned daily at school (detentions ,iscolation,on report ect). I try to make her see they are not against her but she claims they all "hate " her . I impose sanctions depending on the issue ! and reward her if she has a positive week (which sadly seems to be very rare!) .We talk daily her mood changes on the mention alone of school she says she hates it ,teachers hate her,the works to hard ect however she is refusing help as she is to worried by what her peers think . I do get the impression the school have given up on her to a certain extent and they arent meeting her needs but they tell me she is refusin help and resources my DD tells me they have never offered resources or additonal support so its a constant confusing matter!

[anthropology]

My suggestion would be to get an educational assessment WISC4 done for her via school, ed psych or a dyslexis centre asap . If its done properly it will show her strengths as well as vulnerabilities . School should handle it in such a way she isn't embarrassed. there are plenty of amazingly successful people like Jamie Oliver who struggled at school and also there is support in Higher education if she does wish to pursue that, so its sad there is still stigma.

When you have the report, which recommends the support she needs, meet with school and her, and set out a clear timetable or if your DD is refusing support. I suggest a a tutor at home for a while so her friends dont know she is getting help, Someone to help her organise her work/homework. Its going to be much harder for her to motivate and organise herself than others. Can you find a hobby or sport , or something she is really good at and encourage her to pursue something out of school to give her some confidence.

My DD had a WISC done at 15 showing she had amazing verbal skills but poor memory processing issues and concentration . She lost a lot of confidence as Camhs tend to focus on vulnerabilities but once she also understood her strengths, is now off to Uni studying the subject of her choice and with therapy understands what she can and can't cope with. Some brains work differently, not better or worse and if a school gives up on someone, I would move school (which we did ). best of luck.

[cinnamontoast]

I am quite shocked that the school is regularly punishing her when she has additional learning needs. Agree with Anthropology that you should get a proper assessment of her needs done (if they were assessed at primary school, they clearly need doing again). The school should do this and quickly. Kick up a hell of a fuss if they don't!
Does she have an IEP (Individual Educational Plan) with small, achievable targets? Every child on the Special Needs radar should have one and it should be reviewed regularly. The idea is to help her progress in small, measurable steps. Re support in class, a friend of mine who works in special needs once told me that if a child is being supported properly, someone walking into the classroom should not be able to tell which child is being supported - i.e. they should do it sensitively and spend time with other pupils too.
Her behaviour at school could well be a way of distracting from her learning difficulties - children with dyslexia and/or dyspraxia often refuse to engage with the work at all rather than attempt to do it and have everyone see them fail. Try to go easy on her at home - perhaps simply acknowledge that the behaviour at school is wrong but without piling on the punishments.
My DS, now 16, has dyspraxia and some features of Asperger's and eventually got a Statement when he was 10. Even though teachers at his secondary school had been briefed about issues like untidy work, failing to complete a task, lack of concentration, an inability to take instruction given to the whole class rather than to him specifically, some of them would STILL reprimand him for it; others were brilliant, and sensitively tried to make sure he stayed on task. You have to be the parent from hell - as nicely as possible, of course! - and once your DD's needs have been identified, constantly check that the school is responding to them appropriately.
Finally, is there perhaps just one teacher who your DD likes, who is sympathetic to her and sees her positive qualities? If so, do talk to them and see if they can help build her self esteem in their lessons. Sometimes one caring teacher can make all the difference.

[heraldgerald]

Fantastic reponse from anthropology. Absolutely agree. Push, push, push for your daughter to get the right assessment, sounds like ep is needed, but you really need to push for an up dated cognitive and attainment assessment. If you can go private, and insist that the recommendations are incorporated into her iep, do, as that may be quicker.

[lucydaniels4658]

Thanks for the advice ! I would love to pay for a priavte assesment but cant afford it ! She is seeing CAHMS soon (although ive seen lots of negative things about CAHMS on here but hoping our experience will be more positive!) so im really hoping they can push for these kind of things to!
I am already the mother from hell in regards to the school and pushing I think they hate my guts ! The school have just labelled her as "bad attitude ,naughty" and even used the phrase "quite unpleasant" which i was royally pissed off about ! They tend to gang up on me a bit and it becomes a bit my DD'S word against theirs! They say they offer her support in terms of a 1-1 but she refuses this ! It has always been a bit tricky but its just getting worse. I fear what started as an insecurity thing on my DD's part (the lack of concentration ,answering back ect!) has now become an almost enjoyable experience for my DD (as the other students laugh and encourage!) .I think she feels more accepted as class clown now !
She does have an IEP but i think the targets set are to difficult as all are not achieved!
She doesnt have any teachers she gets on with unfortunatly i think in such a big school they never really build a rapor with the students and i think thats what she misses !Primary is such a nuturing enviroment and secondary doesnt seem the same !
The school have started a few different strategies after i asked for the governors details to write a complaint!! However DD is still resistant so far but im hoping things change and maybe with nextyear being options she will (fingers crossed!!) enjoy more as subects she has picked !She was mortified she couldnt drop maths ,science and english!

[cinnamontoast]

You shouldn't have to pay for a private assessment; if the school won't do it quickly enough, go to your GP - I'm pretty sure they can arrange it, or get an appt with a paediatrician who can. Re the IEP, is the school including you in decisions about targets? They are supposed to, you need to sign them off, and the idea is that the targets are small ,measurable steps - so, for example, you might have a target of 'Write 3 sentences for a task set by the teacher' but you wouldn't have 'Complete all work assignments'.
What was your DD's primary school's view of her? If she has changed from being a pleasant member of class to 'bad attitude, naughty', then the school really has to look at itself rather than putting all the blame on her. If they are hostile towards you, then they're idiots, frankly! You are trying to work with them to find a solution - they should be pleased that you want to do that.
I would go ahead and complain to the governors if they don't make a proper assessment an urgent priority. Is the school under LA control or is it an academy? If it's still under LA control you could also contact them and complain about the school's negative attitude. Good luck!

[kleinzeit]

You’ve had some very good advice here, I don’t have any more to add but for what it’s worth my DS always showed his worst side at school, not home. He has an ASC diagnosis and his issues are very different from your DDs. At home he had a nice structured boring life with two adults who could had picked up how to communicate with him. School was the opposite, full of excitement and demands and other kids and liveliness and people who didn't know him well, and it easily got too much for him! But I guess what is similar is that your DD and my DS could meet the demands of home (or out-of-school) more easily than the demands of school.

And although my DS was diagnosed young and has always accepted his diagnosis and was open about it in primary school, he has become more sensitive to being seen as “different” with the teenage years. He had 1-1 in primary school which he refused in secondary on the grounds that it meant he never got a chance to misbehave like the other kids! The school agreed he could try without the 1-1, and in fact it worked because he genuinely had outgrown the need. But as kids get older they do have more choice and he has also turned down a few things that really would help. I do agree with the others to get her needs properly assessed, the school should be able to help her tactfully with things she really needs.

[lucydaniels4658]

Thanks for your responses!
At primary she found it hard to concentrate ,sit still ect had a very weak auditory memory ,couldnt remember instructions ect but she was never rude ,back chatting being disruptive ect this has only started in this school. At primary she was sensitive about her learning needs and used to get emotional but the teachers knew her well and really built up her confidence I feel like secondary has undone all the hard work they did with her! I have never signed a school action plan or IEP and am not even told what the targets are i asked but they never told me which isnt helpful! The gp has done a refferal and the school have also seeing CAHMS soon hoping they help! Ibarely recognise my DD from the description they give of her its baffling!

[cinnamontoast]

Absolutely appalled that the school hasn't involved you in the IEP. You (and your DD) are supposed to be consulted on the targets, and you should certainly be given it for approval and signing off. They can't just set targets for her in isolation.
It might be worth phoning IPSEA for advice. They're very good.
Also, you are entitled to ask to see the school's Special Needs Code of Practice. If nothing else, it will put the wind up them. Sounds like they need a good kicking!

[RandomMess]

Is it worth looking at a different school for her as they seem to be failing her?

[lucydaniels4658]

Ive already asked for that along with governors details and suddenyl they claim they are doing the world for her !When i spoke to her about SENCO offering support and told her the ways she looked bewildered and said they def hadnt !. She isnt one to lie !The things my DD claims they have done are minimal startegies they should be doing for all students with or without extra learning needs!

[HolidayCriminal]

GP won't arrange any assessment if school won't back you up to say that she needs the assessment (bitter experience).

Private assessment costs around £750, say other MNers.

[cinnamontoast]

Many schools don't take private assessments very seriously - they think it's just parents paying someone to say what they want to hear. Better to get the SENCO to arrange one asap. I would start writing down the ways in which they have failed her in prep for my letter to the governors and LA (if applicable). Agree with RandomMess that another school might be the answer, since the one she's at seems incapable of acting effectively.
Hope your DD is enjoying half term and a break from school!

[lucydaniels4658]

thankfully my GP is amazing and very supportive so she secured CAHMS school do support her going but im just fed up with their lack of action. They hate my constant requests but i simply want to see her school action plan and IEP not much to ask they just change the subject and claim there have been lots of "behaviour meetings" about my DD even though i wasnt told they were happening or given much feedback just "shes got worse". At home she is a typical teen in many ways in terms of a bit grumpy and unhelpful but is generally lovely and doesnt ask to stay out late or do any naughty teenage things i was up to by then! Thank god its the half term so nice to not have the agro!