My one year old guinea pig boars have had a nasty bust up...advice please

[dietcokeandwine]

Hoping for some advice from all you guinea experts out there!

We have a pair of one year old brothers, a ginger and a tri-coloured, got them as babies, they have always been housed together. They've gone through periods of being a bit grumpy with each other but put that down to teenage arsiness, grumpy periods were always short-lived and we have done as much as we can to mitigate the strops (large 6ftx4ft playpen during the day, separate hidey spaces, food etc). They are essentially indoor pigs (live in a detached but brick built heated outbuilding in a 2ftx4ft hutch) and get plenty of attention. Tricoloured piggy always seemed to be top pig, ginger one the quieter, mellower of the two.

However...in recent weeks (the pigs spent 3 weeks at my mum's over the holidays whilst we were away, same indoor cage but a different outside run and obviously different environment/smells etc) our ginger pig appears to have taken over the dominant role, if that makes sense, and has started being quite bullish towards the tricoloured one, hassling him constantly. Culminating in, this morning, me taking them out to put them in their run and noticing that tricoloured pig had a nastily bleeding torn ear . This obviously happened either overnight or first thing this morning as he was fine when I got them in from their run yesterday evening...

So two questions:

1. Will tricoloured pig need vet attention? He seems fine in himself, I have bathed and cleaned the ear in warm salt water and he didn't seem in pain - shook his head a few times whilst I was cleaning him but certainly no whimpering/squealing and was happily distracted by a handful of parsley which he wolfed down ...do I need to just make sure the ear is kept clean whilst it heals? Is there anything else a vet might advise?
   

1. Is this the end for them living together? From what I have read minor 'altercations' are normal for young boars but once blood has been shed that is kind of the end...feel so sad if that is the case but would rather separate them than risk further injury to tricoloured pig...As a precautionary measure we have put a section of their indoor pen frame into the outdoor run to divide it in two (so they can see each other but ginger can't get at tricolour whilst his ear is healing) and I've been out and bought a second indoor hutch this morning (slightly smaller version of the 2x4ft Savic hutch they were originally sharing) which one of them can go into whilst the ear heals. (We haven't got enough room for the hutches to go alongside one another so they won't be able to see each other but they will smell/hear each other).
   

1. and finally...if/when we try to reintroduce them...what best way to do it? Obviously not till the ear heals...Would scrub out the larger cage, introduce them on neutral territory etc...should I bath them too? And realistically, is there any way they might happily live together again, or would a reintroduction most likely end in tears/injuries? Would we be best to have them both neutered (or are they too old for this at 12mnths?) and find them a female friend each...or just let them live 'near' each other?
   

Any advice most welcome! Thank you in advance

[BonkeyMollocks]

Ok, I'm a semi expert-ish in this (thanks Big Pig and Little Pig )

1. If he seems ok, then I would just keep it clean and give it a few days. When my two had a fight Little Pig had a really swollen cheek. I was going to take him to the vet on the following Mon but it was going down and he seemed fine. It healed nicely in the end.
   

2/3 . I think its entirely up to you whether you re-introduce or not. My Big Pig was a lone boar when he was bought at 4 (ish) months old , got Little Pig a few weeks later (5/6 wks old) , and they got on like a house on fire after the initial humping period. Then suddenly all hell broke loose and the fought. This one wasn't to bad (no blood) so I separated them at night time (cage) and put them back together in the day pen.
This worked fine for a while and then they had another tiff which resulted in Big Pig (who was meant to be boss) having a bloody lip.
I think what happened was Little Pig got a rage of hormones and decided that he wanted to be top pig and stopped backing down.

I tried to get them back together a month later.
I scrubbed the pen, bathed the pigs, then put them in the kitchen because it was neutral ground.
Nothing there they could fight over, 2 of everything, no tunnels/hideys etc and buckets of veg and hay to keep them busy.

All was well for a few hours, put them in the pen, sat watching them armed with a water spray, and apart from abit of chasing they were fine.

Then I went to the shop and came home to carnage :( . Dh said that he had to chuck a cushion at them because they locked mouths and went mental. Both pigs ended up with blood on them. Little Pig had a swollen cheek and was very subdued for a few hours, Big Pig had a bloody nose. It was awful! :(

They now live side by side with grids separating them. They can still see, sniff, play etc through the bars but I think they really appreciate their own space.
I haven't had the balls to try them back together. They still square up to each other occasionally through the bars and I don't think I want to risk it just yet still slightly traumatised from the last buck , but I may give it one last go in the future when all the blasted hormones have gone.

My advice from my experience is if you are willing to risk a neutering then do that and get them each a female mate, or possible take them to a rescue and match them up again.

By all means try and get them back together but everything will need a scrub, pigs will need a bath, and you will need to watch them like hawks!

I found the 'Stickys' on this page good helpful reading. (You may have to join the forum before you can see) .


Good luck, its so awful when they fall out, I don't understand why my boys don't sit for a moment and realise that they would have double the space to run in if they just got on! Stoopid pigs!

[BonkeyMollocks]

I should add, that if my dh wasn't such a tight bastard then I would have got both of mine neutered and got them a wife.

[dietcokeandwine]

Bonkey thank you so much for that response and the link, really helpful Tricolour's ear is definitely healing nicely, I've checked him over and he was chatting away and seemed fine and he's wolfed down his tea, so I'm hoping we'll avoid a vet's visit...Will clean it again in the morning but I think he's on the mend. Certainly doesn't seem in the slightest bit bothered by it.

I am definitely going to have a go at re-bonding them. Going to leave it till the weekend, to give tricolour's ear a few days to heal up completely, then give them a bath together and put them back into a scrubbed clean cage with the hidey spaces rearranged so it seems 'new'....and keep fingers crossed. Neutering/wifey acquisition can be the reserve option! Actually, other than the worries about the risks of the neutering op (presumably they'd be OK at just under a year old? Both are in great health generally) I'd be massively up for the idea of a couple of girly companions for them...problem is I'm 4 months pregnant and feeling shocking and would prefer not to have too much upheaval over the next few months if at all possible. I'll do it, of course, though, if it becomes apparent they're not going to rebond....just hope I don't have to

The more I think about it the more I wonder whether the 3 week trip away really unsettled ginger pig...it is such a shame as he is the most beautifully natured pig as far as human contact is concerned. And I can't help feeling sad that they managed to live together happily for a year before falling out like this...they both seem really agitated at being separated too Unfortunately we just don't have the space to put two cages side by side so ginger pig's cage is underneath the bigger cage, therefore they can't see each other, but there's nothing I can do about that really. Ironically it is tricolour pig who seems saddest about being on his own!

Thanks so much for the help though. I'm off to the Gorgeous Guineas website to get them some nice shampoo

[70isaLimitNotaTarget]

Hi dietcoke - the GPs ears are so thin there's not much the vet could do . If it's kept clean it will start the 'knit' together. (Our cat used to get in scraps and come home with torn ears and they are the same thickness as GP ears.They always mended with no intervention)

Our boys had to be seperated at night last year (though I put them together in the Pighouse by day).They have enough room to escape each other, but still have the odd heads up.

When they saw the Rodentologist she suggested they have all in one cage (their night time winter cage) so I'm going to chance it this winter and take out the grille between them.
If they've got plenty of distraction (hay) then it should keep them busy.
Make sure your boars can still see and smell each other if they are seperate .My GP1 gets very fretful if his brother is taken away from him, but not if he's taken away from GP2.

With ours, I put it down to coriander overdose. It was the little one who instigated it (quite nasty, he got his teeth right onto GP1s back )

Ours had a week away and were a bit silly when they came home- lots of bumping each others' rumps and annoying their greasespots, but nothing worse.

Definately try neutral territory and a bath to make them smell the same.
I've heard people using those DAP infusers ( for dogs mainly to give them happy puppy feelings).
Water pistol might be enough to stop them in their tracks if they get a bit arsey.

Good Luck.

[70isaLimitNotaTarget]

didn't read about you can't side-by-side them.

They'll still be able to smell and hear each other- at least that's some contact.

[dietcokeandwine]

thank you 70...funny you say that about the coriander overdose, ours had had parsley last night for the first time in ages. Hmmm, I wonder if parsley overdose contributed to the bust-up as well!

No, we can't side by side them in the hutch unfortunately. We can in the run, though, and they'll be out again tomorrow, so that's something.

That's a good idea re the water pistols/DAP infusers too...8 year old DS would love the idea of a water pistol

[BonkeyMollocks]

Parsley turns Little Pig in to a menace.

A cute hyper.menace but I would.never give it to him if he was with Big Pig!

[70isaLimitNotaTarget]

Ours will eat parsely till they turn green but we've never given them coriander since the fight.
It was so out of character for GP2 .He's normally mild mannered and laid back, but we were by it all.

[fortifiedwithtea]

When OB's brother was alive holiday time was always unsettling. Despite OB being tiny he was top boar (huge personality has OB). Neighbours looked after the boys in their own enviroment but it made no difference. The day after we were home would signal a fight and OB would come off worse.

For afew days brother would be dominate but really unhappy about it as he was really a timid soul. Then OB would take over again and they would both be happy again.

I would try to get your piggies back together as soon as possible. Good luck.

[dietcokeandwine]

Just wanted to say thanks again to everyone for the advice, and to give a quick update...Guineas have had a bath in some 'Just for Boars' shampoo this afternoon (hilarious because they kept shaking themselves vigorously and DS1 and I got soaked ) and have been dried etc. Have put them into their indoor daypen, on a clean fleece/hidey holes scrubbed with a new pet disinfectant/plenty of hay/food....tricolour obviously having a fruity day as keeps trying to mount ginger guinea, but no face-offs as yet. Lots of general chirruping and the odd squeak or squawk, but so far, so good

Will put them back into their usual indoor hutch later which again has been scrubbed clean and made up with fresh shavings and bedding....am slightly worried about how they'll be during the night, but not much I can do about that I guess, I can hardly sit up all night watching them

[BonkeyMollocks]

Great news!

I hope they stay settled!

:)