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If your 3yo language disordered dc can read/write

(29 Posts)
sammythemummy Tue 18-Feb-14 17:45:06

Small CVC words, where are they now?

Did they grow up with a learning disability or did they thrive in school?

Please share smile

ProfessorSkullyMental Tue 18-Feb-14 18:23:27

can you expand on what you mean by 3yo language disordered?

my 7yo didnt speak until he was 3.5 and at nursery, but i dont know if thats what you mean to share the rest smile

chocnomore Tue 18-Feb-14 18:56:06

no first hand expience. have you googled hyperlexia? according to wikipedia hyperlexia can go hand in hand with speech/language difficulties.

sammythemummy Tue 18-Feb-14 19:14:18

She's delayed but slowly getting better.

The type of sentences she will say are:

"Mum, (her name) don't want to go home"

"You turn" instead of "your"

"Can I water please?" Forgetting the "have"

Sometimes muddles up her I want with I don't want.

Im not really after a dx (got hfa dx) I just wanted to know in terms of learning disability

zzzzz Tue 18-Feb-14 19:26:38

Ds1 could read cvc words at that age. He is still language disordered at 8.
School was too hard (not the core academic bit). He is HE and lovely.

I've no idea where we're going. grin. ROLLERCOASTER. grin

sammythemummy Tue 18-Feb-14 19:48:37

Can he read/write fluently now zzzz?

Would you say he doesn't have a learning disability?

professor I meant to share where your children are in terms of education

zzzzz Tue 18-Feb-14 20:16:23

I don't really understand what a learning disability is??? blush

Ds1 is very very smart but he accesses the world through a very poor interface. The angry age disorder hasn't gone away. He's older so he knows more words and has learnt some sentence structures. He still struggles in the same way he would be if he was overcoming deafness or blindness. He's just older now.

He can read (Gruffalo rather than paperback). He has hypermobile hands so writing is never going to be easy. He can do basic maths and occasionally age appropriate maths (the issue is language not mathematical ability so graphs easy peasy, wordy question more difficult).

He has no self preservation type skills, so roads, stranger danger etc still toddler level.

Other people find him very disabled, me less so.

zzzzz Tue 18-Feb-14 20:17:02

Angry age=language shock

coppertop Tue 18-Feb-14 20:26:38

Ds really only started talking at around 3yrs. He referred to himself in the 3rd person until he was about 5'ish, and everyone (male or female) was "he".

He started to read out random words from 2+yrs. and hyperlexia was mentioned but not diagnosed. He had a dx of HFA.

He's now 13yrs old and you would never guess that he ever had language difficulties. He's doing very well at school.

AgnesDiPesto Tue 18-Feb-14 20:34:10

DS1 is similar to zzzz's DS
He has classic moderate autism dx. Very disordered language. He could read at 2-3. He is now 7 and can read at age 8 level.
His understanding is probably about age 3-4 level.
His expressive language is about the level your DD sentences are now. He struggles to think of / find the right word although he can understand if others say them.
He is age appropriate with mathematical aspects of maths, behind with word problems
He knows all his times tables up to 14, instantly! He can recite books by heart. Very very bright and quick to learn things that interest him.
He reads picture not chapter books still. Still likes toddler type stories and cartoons.
No sense of danger, understanding of world etc
His memory is amazing but often learns without understanding.
In terms of the phrases used by my LA he does not have a 'learning disability' - by which they mean below normal range IQ (here they say a LD means IQ below 70). His IQ was tested for tribunal at age 3 and was 90 but believed to have a true IQ above this (he wasn't very co-operative with the test at 3!). Within that his verbal and non verbal IQ are vastly different.
His autism and language disorder are clearly very disabling though! Here they would call that 'learning difficulties'.
His ABA supervisor explains it in terms of his learning difficulties and split skills are explained by his autism, he doesn't have any additional learning disability on top of his autism.

PolterGoose Tue 18-Feb-14 20:36:50

Learning disability usually means IQ under 70, so a dx of HFA would mean no learning difficulty per se, but children (adults too) can have sky high IQ and have significant problems learning or a child/adult might have an IQ that signifies a learning disability but has really good functional skills, compliance etc that makes learning new skills easier.

Are you saying your dd is reading and writing CVC words?

AgnesDiPesto Tue 18-Feb-14 20:39:22

I didn't answer the bit about school! I would not say he thrives at school. He thrives in 1:1 / with ABA. He could not manage mainstream without specialist support. There is a benefit to him being (PT) in mainstream for now, less sure about the medium to longer term. He still needs language concepts specifically taught. He does pick up some language himself now but its like watching a DVD a frame at a time, its incredibly slow. He still can't have a conversation and has never asked a why question.

sammythemummy Tue 18-Feb-14 20:54:51

Just been reading on hyperplaxia copper a lot of the descriptions fit my dd, interesting read.

Zzzz I think agnes described what I meant by learning disability, in terms of IQ.

copper how did your ds learn about pronouns? My dd switches from using her name to using I, on her own. She refuses to say she or he and says their names instead.

Actually I do recall saying "he's my friend" when asking about another child. But I suspect she's copied that from her peers.

Yes polter but obviously it's only some words and her name.

Ifcatshadthumbs Tue 18-Feb-14 20:59:24

Ds has a language disorder/asd he's 6 now and he's reading ORT Stage 2. Something's clicked with reading in the last couple of months and he's making good progress.

sammythemummy Tue 18-Feb-14 21:01:26

Zzz I love angry age disorder... What are the symptoms? grin

agnes that was very informative, thank you so much. Iv just started ABA with her but they're just concentrating on her social skills, so we're setting up a nursery programme.

Btw I've just received the letter for a statuary assessment in the post today, so yay!

One step closer...

zzzzz Tue 18-Feb-14 21:03:04

I should have said your dds language is far more advanced than ds1s at 3

sammythemummy Tue 18-Feb-14 21:04:39

Oh btw, she self taught the reading and writing. I'm asking all these questions because I'm not sure if I should push her with this when her language is not in order. But she's always been fascinated by the letters and numbers from 18 months and now loves to scribble "words" on paper or makes out words with the lettered blocks

zzzzz Tue 18-Feb-14 21:09:08

I pulled back on the reading maths because I was an idiot. I thought he was already so odd, it would make him more different. It really was silly

Exploit EVERY positive, ALWAYS and with joy. The other learning hangs off the things we're interested/good at.

Reading particarly helps. Both language structure and PR with teachers and classmates.

ProfessorSkullyMental Tue 18-Feb-14 21:09:21

my ds has dyspraxia, he didnt speak more than the odd single word until he was 3.5, so right now, your dds language ability is above and beyond what his was.

ds probably started using sentences by about 4, and by 4.5 was talking almost normally. By the time he started reception aged 5 (early sept birthday) he was talking completely normally and hasnt shut up since.

he cant write because of the dyspraxia, but his reading ability is 18mo ahead of his peers right now at aged 7 and he's been assessed as being highly intelligent.

PolterGoose Tue 18-Feb-14 21:12:35

I would go for it, I've found that building on interests has been very beneficial, the Book People always have good deals on phonics scheme type books for home use. Ds loved the Jolly Phonics they did at school so we had the poster smile

ConstantCraving Tue 18-Feb-14 21:22:13

My DD 4 is awaiting a diagnosis but HFA is suspected. She can read and spell and loves words, she also has an amazing memory. She talks in the 3rd person and keeps a running commentary up about what she is doing, or what others are doing e.g. 'DD (her name) is going to have a drink' or 'you will have a drink', when she means 'me'. Not sure on her level of comprehension really and this is to be assessed as well. She doesn't really talk to peers, but ignores them or talks 'at' them (the commentary thing again....). She had an observation by a specialist autism support worker who was shocked by her ability with language and her memory - she mentioned 'gifted / savant abilities' - but also said that with her social skills she is clearly going to struggle. Also problems with fine motor skills, limited diet, bowel issues, control issues etc etc. Am hanging onto gifted....

coppertop Tue 18-Feb-14 22:28:15

I can't honestly remember how ds picked up pronouns. Dd was born when ds was 5yrs old, so it might even have been a case of finally having a 'real' girl to compare to (we already had another ds).

Someone said to me that other children would be using their language skills to help with their reading, but that ds could use his reading ability to help with his language skills.

I think a lot of ds' language quirks improved when he read more books and could see in writing how the sentences were set out.

The one thing to be careful of though, if you suspect hyperlexia, is to make sure that people are aware that comprehension levels might not match reading levels. It would be the equivalent of you/me reading out a novel in a language that you've only ever really learned at a basic conversational level. You could probably read the words perfectly, but still have no real clue what it was about.

ouryve Tue 18-Feb-14 22:36:03

My 3yo language disordered boy who could read and write already had a diagnosis of ASD, at that point. He's now a 10yo with ASD and ADHD and is very academically able, but struggling with a mainstream school environment and we're desperate to get him into a quieter setting that is better equipped to meet his needs.

He also detests literacy.

sammythemummy Wed 19-Feb-14 09:55:17

Yes I know what you mean about the comprehension, although so far she's only reading very small words that she knows the meaning of.

our interesting that your ds hates literacy now... I've got a feeling she might go off it once it's demanded off her, right now it's her "hobby".

She doesn't like to get things wrong either, so If she isn't able to write a particular letter she'll "you do it"

I guess I desperately want to know how she will cope with school demands.

AgnesDiPesto Wed 19-Feb-14 10:33:04

Is she reading by sight or phonics?
DS rote learnt whole words at 2-3 but still needed to learn phonics at school. He didn't pass the phonics test at year 1 as he couldn't read the fake words (because he knew they were not real and would choose a similar real word assuming it must be an error!).His whole word learning will probably get him quite far but being able to read by phonics / blending will get him further. So his whole word reading is ahead but his phonic reading is behind. He learnt phonic sounds easily, it was blending them he struggled with.
There are free resources on teacher websites for pronouns etc eg teacherspayteachers where teachers sell lesson plans to each other but there are lots of free ones available on there too.
The works / tkmaxx / whsmiths have get ready for school books which DS loves - look for some which also cover understanding. Sequencing is really useful way of using reading skills eg can be putting a familiar story in order or a routine eg baking a cake. We have sequencing picture cards but you can get free resources off internet. Making your own books eg of an outing etc. or rewriting a story using different characters or photos of her - DS can be quite rigid and at school they often take a story and change bits of it. Acting out stories can help with play and social.
Wh questions have been a huge issue for us - spent about 2 years on this and he still hasn't entirely got it.
ABA or a ABA friendly SLT will be able to advise how to use reading etc to help develop understanding and language skills.

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