LEA Funding independent mainstream school

[T3009]

Dear all, has anyone been successfull with the LEA funding (whether partial or full) an independent mainstream school - please share your experience/best approach etc
DS will start reception in Sept 2013, and we're looking into independent maisntream school. He performs better in smaller setting.

Many thanks

[StarlightMcKenzie]

All children perform better in a smaller setting so you won't get it on that basis.

You will have to prove that he can't perform at all in a state mainstream which will be very hard (though not impossible) to do. You will also have to prove that the difference in performance justifies the cost to the tax payer.

[KOKOagainandagain]

Does the mainstream school have a unit? What particular learning difficulties does DS have? Proof that DS could not perform at all in state ms would also likely prove that he was not able to perform in any ms - state or independent.

[T3009]

hi, thanks for response. DS is HF asd - in the process of finalising statement - so far been given funding for 25 hours of ABA in private nursery - we are funding for the nursery.
He performs better in a smaller setting, he fnds big group quite overwhelming - hence we would like, if at all, possible to put him in a small group in an independent school.
I would like him to eb supportd by an ABA shawdow in small setting in mainstream.

[KOKOagainandagain]

From the LEAs pov this could be belt and braces if they were being expected to fund independent setting with small classes and 1:1. You could of course pay the fees yourself with the 1:1 and other interventions funded by the LEA. Would this be a possibility?

[T3009]

We'll we're happy to pay the fees provided they pay the support..This is why I wnat to hear about others who have been through this situation - whether they paid fees and LEA fund support or LEA paid fees etc etc...We're quite flexible to be honest.

[hatchypom]

We paid fees and lea funded support

[gaia]

Hi T, I've responded to your message and just seen this thread as well. I just wanted to say that like hatchypom we paid the school fees and the lea funded the 1 to 1 support. One of our arguments was that all we were asking for was the support our child would have got in the state sector. And again, we found IPSEA very helpful.

[moosemama]

Sorry for the hijack, but I am interested in the idea of parents paying fees and LEA funding interventions.

We are currently in the situation of just finding out our chosen secondary (new academy) is refusing to be named on ds1's statement.

We've been advised by various people to look at a particular out of area independent, that isn't a ss, but has a lot of expertise in supporting children with a variety of SENs, particularly HFA and AS and these make up a good proportion of their intake. It looks fantastic, but obviously we would have to fight to get the LEA to fund it. There are children from our LEA already attending the school, so there is a precedent there.

We have been told by the statementing officer that they want ds in the secondary we've chosen and that given their reasons for refusal, if they lose the fight to get him in there, he is effectively rendered unsuitable for any ms secondary.

Is it easier to get the LEA to agree to an independent placement if you offer to pay the fees yourself (not that I have a clue how we would manage it) and is this something that would be possible with an out of area placement?

[sickofsocalledexperts]

I have a good pal who had to fight like hell (though not as far as tribunal) but eventually got LSA paid for while she paid school fees. It has been a fantastic success I would say, and he may be able to fly solo at secondary.

[theDudesmummy]

This is exactly what we want to do, if we can find the school which will accept it! We are just at the beginning of statementing process, all we want is some ABA funding, and we have been upfront about this from the outset.

[theDudesmummy]

Hatchypom and gaia that is very encouraging.

[theDudesmummy]

Also encouraging news from sickof, and glad it was a success.

[sickofsocalledexperts]

The thing is that, in theory, if your child's statement would entitle them to an LSA in mainstream, then those funds should be flexibly available elsewhere. I make that about £20 k per annum - eg 15k salary for LSA and £5k for the pupil premium or whatever it s called. The new SEN white paper has banged on about parents having more choice of provider, so.... But of course what happens at local council level is often far removed from what central govt is trying to make happen!

[mariammama]

But in the new arrangements for 2013/14, the state school place itself is costed at £4k and then the first £6k of extra SEN funding comes from the school's existing budget. So the LA only has to top up a bit.

I would guess the private school £10-12k fees would be considered as equivalent to the state's £4k, and the LA would want you/ private school to cough up the first £6k of SEN support on top. You might win if challenging this, but it'd be complex.

Can you put DS in a big nursery 2 days and a small one 2 days? to prove that big groups are totally worthless to him?

[T3009]

Hi, I am not very much into the arrangements for 2013/2014 - where can I find all the information about funding etc... That's a good idea, I could send him to a smaller setting at an independent school's nursery as from January for 2 days and prove that he performs better in smaller group!
I will get a private ed psych report and private SLT report at the time of the review.
We are finalising current Statement which states ABA in mainstream nursery - DS already attends private nursery where he gets 15 hours free and I top up.
The proposed statement mentioned special school which we refused.
My main worry are the units in our borough - how could I argue against the unit.

[sickofincompetenceandbullshit]

In my LA, a number of children have their fees and TA paid for at selective independent mainstreams...without Tribunal in some cases. Independent m/s is cheap compared to independent special!

[theDudesmummy]

We have a brand new special school in our borough (non-ABA, goodness knows why they are still setting up such schools without using the evidence base to inform their teaching but anyway...) and I don't imagine we would be able to argue against it (except for the fact that we believe that only ABA is the way to go for DS, which may not be their opinion!). That is why we are planning to go for (and pay for) indep school, I don't imagine the LEA would pay the school fees as they would argue he could go to their school for free.

So I am going to focus on getting ABA funded (or at least part-funded) and resign myself to paying the school fees. We were planning to have him go to indep school anyway, before we knew he had special needs (his name has been down from birth for several of the very academic schools but they are distinctly non-interested now).

[ilikemysleep]

I'm sorry but it depends on your local authority.

I am certain that this info is correct as we have been briefed by barristers who specialise in SEN.

In the Code of Practice, and SEN law, there is no way that a local authority can legally name an independent mainstream school in the statement without being liable to pay the fees.

Some local authorities make arrangements eg to pay the same as the child would have had in state mainstream, but these are local arrangements.

If your LA doesn't make these local arrangements, they will be very reluctant to name a m/s independent as they will have to pay the fees as well as the additionality and this will make it an inefficient use of taxpayer's money as they can provide a mainstream education with the same additionality from within their own state schools.

With luck you'll have a LA that makes these arrangements, but if you don't they will likely fight you to tribunal, and if they are being reasonable in funding ABA etc they will have a strong case.

[theDudesmummy]

Well I very much hope I can make a deal with them as I have no intention of asking them to pay the school fees. I would not ask them to put the indep school into the statement, just the 1:1 help he will need at school (if they won't fund the full cost of an ABA tutor then just the equivalant of what a TA will cost would do, I would be happy to top it up).

[theDudesmummy]

PS if they are "being reasonable in funding ABA" I would not be taking them to Tribunal! All I want is a contribution to the ABA, if I even get a portion of that I won't fight them any further! Basically: I can afford private school, or ABA, or even private school and part of ABA, but probably not both private school and full cost of ABA.

[theDudesmummy]

T3009 please do let us know what your statement ends up saying!

[T3009]

theDudesmummy - hi basically they said only 25 hours of 1:1 funding which we will ue towards ABA, they do not want to put ABA on statement-advised to go for it at this stage and in the meantime, get all evidence for review in March./April. if they refuse to negotaite, we'll start appeal by Feb.
I will def go for independent school. FOund a lovely school yesterday but with witing list!

[thereonthestair]

the school I want to send my DS to is independent small classes etc, and I want to send him because he can't walk without a walker (CP) and he really can't cope in a big school as he would get knocked over. It also happens to be the nearest school to home by some margin and therefore the only school he would currently have a hope of being able to get to independently. The school have a few children who have 1-1 funded by our lea where parents pay the basic fees. I am therefore going to keep a watch on this as I am working out what to do next. DS gets 25 hours 1-1 in nursery so I hope it may carry over

[theDudesmummy]

T3009 is that 25 hours a week of the "1 to 1"? If I could get that I would be really happy! I don't care whether they call it ABA or a barrel of cheese, I just want the money!

[T3009]

Hi, yes 25 hrs 1:1 support at nursery...