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SEN

ds diagnosed with ADHD. Unsure of diagnosis, unsure about everything, and school situation complicated, so help please!!

23 replies

ernest · 23/01/2008 07:59

Ds2 (aged just 7) was diagnosed yesterday with ADHD. I know he has attention problems but I was shocked/surprised. I do think there's 'something wrong' with him, for sure, I thought, tho acknowledge am no expert, that it was more like dyspraxia.

My doubts re diagnosis are mainly that he doesn't fit my limited stereotypical image of a child with ADHD. Yes, he is impulsive, lacks concentration etc etc, but the main thing is he's not at all agressive. I've read many times on here about ADHD making kids wild, smashing things up, very agressive, lots of fight and trouble. That part doesn't fit my ds at all. But then dh thinks I'm mad, that doc is expert not me (of course) and not every child has every symptom. What do you all think?

Anyway, that diagnosis aside, the doc did say he is very intelligent (99%) and was likely to be extremely can't think of word - under stretched at school, leading to further probs.

Cor this is long, sorry. ANy advice how to help my boy?

What I'm unsure about is - he is currently in a swiss school, and will change to Brtitish school in Spetember. Very different system, where he'll go from being tin Yr1 to Yr 3, so a huge gap. SO actually, he's going to go from being really erm under stretched, to probably totally out of his depth, so worried how he'll cope with that frustration.

Second point unsure about - it's a private school. We filled in and submitted form already, amongst which was medical form asking if he had an sen. Dh filled in form and said no (truthful, cos at that point he had no diagnosis, but also dh not really so sure he had prob, mind you, he'd completely forgotten that ds3 had been circumsised so he's not really on the ball anyway..)

SO, do I tell the school and risk him being rejected, or discuss it once he starts, explaining diagnosis happened earlier. Or just leave it and see how he/they get on..

Phew, and finally, doc said not npoow but in future we needed to consider meds eg ritalin, which blew me away really. But given doc in ch, do we really need to go through whole process again? I saw on here that in UK you need consultant prescription. Tho we're actually moving to Italy, not UK.

Oh and one more finally, can anyone recommend a book or something so I can read/learn a bit more, so I can best help my ds.

And what is the done form. DO I tell ds about the diagnosis or just let him carry on, blissfully unaware?

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yurt1 · 23/01/2008 08:48

I think the aggressiveness that sometimes goes with ADHD can arise because of impulsiveness - so a toy gets broken because a child impulsively chucks it across the room etc. It's not agrressiveness per se- other children with ADHD may lash out due to sensory type issues.

I wouldn't talk to the school until you know more about it, but it might be worth having a quick chat with them before he goes in. How is he getting on at school now?

As for reading, have a look at the Jessica Kingsley publishers website- she has lots of books on ADHD. Worth signing up to her mailing list as well.

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GooseyLoosey · 23/01/2008 08:51

I have no experience of this, but for what its worth, my opinions are:

If you intuitively think that the diagnosis may be wrong and that part of the problem may be your son is understretched, I think I would be tempted to wait and see what happens in September at the new school. Things may be completely different there - does he cope well with change?

As ds is only 7, not sure that I would say anything to him at the moment about adhd - telling him he has a "condition" might make him think that he does not have to take any action about his concentration - also not nice to be stuck with labels at 7. Maybe say that you recognise that he has trouble concentrating and it is something that you are all going to have to work on, particularly at his new school.

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yurt1 · 23/01/2008 08:57

I would leave the telling him until you know more about it, and you're ahppy that the diagnosis is correct, but I would tell him sooner rather than later, or it becomes a 'secret', and gets harder to talk about. It can be done in a very positive way. Luke Jackson's book on Freaks Geeks and Asperegers syndrome is worth reading (he writes quite a bit about his brother who has very severe ADHD- he also talks about the importance of being told a diagnosis).

I don't think kids see these names as loaded labels, more as explanations iyswim.

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ernest · 23/01/2008 09:21

gl, sorry if that was unclear. My ds def. has problems aside from being understretched at school, of that I am sure. He is very impulsive, cannot deal with frustration, is unwilling to try new things, cries at the drop of a hat, has extremely poor fine motor skills, has difficulty listening and taking on board instructions, ie needs multiple senses like holding his shoulders, maintaining eye contact while giving him an instruction for it to register, very poor concentration .... I was a teacher in a former life and have 3 dss, so am sure there is 'something' but just not sure what ifswim. At this time I don't think the 'understretching' is too big a problem as he is currently attending school in his 2nd language, so in that way he is getting more mental stimulation than if he were receiving education in English lang. But, he is still pissingabout thoroughly learning his numbers in great depth, and at age 7 they're still learning how to write and manipulate the number 10. and adding numbers up to 10. He is by far way way more capable than that. otoh, it is helping his fine motor skills a great deal to be doing all this so slowly. This would however be a problem if he remained in this system I think.

I was just surprised it's ADHD and not something else cos of the aggressive aspect which is missing in ds.

Re the new school, I just don't want to get into trouble for not telling them if they found out later and think we're deliberately misleading them. He is, thank God, very happy in school but he is currently blessed with 2 extremely able, patient and warm, absolutely fantastic teachers, who also clearly have a great deal of warmth towards him, and they're very very kind, and also suspected ADHD before I even mentioned a word, so they're also experienced and tolerant.

Dh is happier with diagnosis, and if I learn enough to know that ADHD doesn't automatically mean agression I'd be more confident myself, I've just read time and time again on here that the 2 seem to go hand in hand, which has caused my doubts.

Good to hear your pov about telling, yurt. Will wait till dh comes home at w/e to discuss and see what he thinks too, but I'm inclined to agree with you., thanks

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yurt1 · 23/01/2008 09:30

I really don't think ADHD has to involve aggression. If someone asked me to define ADHD in one word I'd say 'impulsive' (far more part of it than hyperactivity etc imo).

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ernest · 23/01/2008 10:46

impulsive definately fits.

looked at those publishers. ther's a book, not yet released, that looks great, so might wait for that.

ds veyr much like the psych & had great time with him and enjoyed going, so so far it's all been v. positive for him so hope this will like you say be positive & helpful, rather than neg label.

any ideas how to tell/what to say, is a book a good idea (am book addict)

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ahundredtimes · 23/01/2008 10:56

I would read the books first, so you understand ADHD fully, there will be some parts where you go 'yes, yes, yes' and others where you think 'Mmm, not sure about that.'

Then to be honest, I would tell the school. It might seem like the worst case scenario to you that they don't take him - but actually the worse case scenario is that you send him to a school which is either unprepared or totally incapable of meeting his needs. I think it's important you put your ds first not the school.

And I'd hold off talking to ds for a bit - though agree with Yurt that it shouldn't be too long - you need to absorb the information first.

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ahundredtimes · 23/01/2008 10:58

With any luck they won't say 'oh, we don't have a place then' and they will say 'thank you so much for telling us.' Schools really need honesty from parents I think, and it's the right way to start, and if they can't meet his needs you don't want to send him there.

I think I've just repeated myself.

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maggiems · 23/01/2008 11:04

My Dt2 is very inattentive at school but is not hyperactive , although he is impulsive. I know from researching that there are 2 types of inattentive conditions, ADHD and ADD, the former being Attention deficit disorder with hyperactivity and the latter the inattentive subtype, which is without hyperactivity. I think my Dt2 has traits of Add but not ADHD. I would have thought though that if your Ds was diagnosed with the inattentive subtype this would have been clarified. I also think that the hyperactivity associated with ADHD is not driven by aggression but by impulsivity. My Dt2 is, as I said impulsive and sort of bouncy in terms of his movement but not hyperactive or aggressive

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ernest · 23/01/2008 11:26

hi, thanks. re school, problem is it's not in Uk and only british school so it's not like there's an alternative. The school looks very good, and will certainly be better than no school at all, or having to start education afresh in Italian for the next 2 years...

tho I agree I feel i should come clean. Maybe I'll wait till I have more info from doc (hope he can eg give me photocopy of the IQ tests he did, plus a report on him.

I don't want them to hear ADHD and run screaming for the hills or picture him as a trouble maker or disruptive. I've never had a complaint from his current school about him at all.

It's all a bit too new and fresh and scary right now and has come at a time of great family upheaval so don't want to rush into anything, need to balance being honest and open with being carefula dn not rushing in, but can't see wood for trees right now.

doesn't help that dh away so no one to dscuss wth. that's where you lot come in

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ahundredtimes · 23/01/2008 13:44

I'd write them a letter maybe ernest, not now, in a bit? Then you can say we have recently had this diagnosis, these are my observations about ds and this is what the ed psych has said. You can make it personal to him, rather than the label - and if his current school has worked for him, they can write a letter too.

You can say that he doesn't get in trouble at school and be very specific as to who he is, and how he operates.

BUT still check them out for proper support, because it's pointless sending him there - even if the others are a non-starter - if they are going to shout at him and expect him to do things/behave in a way that isn't within his grasp just now.

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ernest · 23/01/2008 20:34

ok, one more Q on this.

I originally took ds2 to get seen because ds1 has had problems at school and I was worried that it would be far worse for ds2 when he started, as I find him a lot more challenging.

Anyway, I have concerns ds1 may also have this. Dh rolls his eyes at this one. I am torn as to whether to get ds1 also assessed?

ANy thoughts?

(I 1st of all thougth I'd use the dx for ds2 as a learning experience and modify my parenting etc for both boys). but, with dh for eg kind of rejecting ds1 also having problems, although it is ds1 who has had a few problems at school, not ds2 surprisingly enough) maybe it will take a formal dx to convince dh. Also from a schools pov is it better to have the dx or not? Does it take long to get dx in UK? Maybe better to have him seen to here where it will be quick (but expensive?)

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evenhope · 23/01/2008 21:21

I found this book very helpful.

My DS was dx at 7, just before he transferred to a private school. I can't remember whether we told them- I suppose we must have done.

He had been incredibly bored at primary school but flourished once pushed, and responded really well to the stricter regime.

I didn't tell DS because I didn't want him to use it as an excuse for bad behaviour. They told him at the clinic when he was about 13 and I was

Another good book is this one

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ernest · 24/01/2008 06:33

still v. undecided about getting ds1 assessed. Any thoughts anyone?

Those books look good. Evenhope, you say dx ag 7, but he was at clinic age 8. What happens in UK then, on going assessmen? Annual check up/reviews? No idea what to expect.

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ernest · 24/01/2008 13:42

bump? pös

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magso · 24/01/2008 13:48

I am not an expert just a parent ( who long ago lived in switz)of a child diagnosed with ADHD on his 5th birthday! He now has a dx of ASD and SLD and Im not sure if that cancels out the ADHD Dx! In my experience it can take months or years to get a full Dx of any developmental condition via the state system! On average if I remember correctly the stats quoted in a recent ADDIS survey it takes more than 2 years from first asking the GP for referral to DX of adhd in the uk.
Some of the medications used to treat children with (the more severe) ADHD are usually only presribed by a specialised paediatrician in clinic, so children on these medications are reviewed regularly eg every 3- 6 months. I exspect this becomes less often with age and if medication is stopped. I know of a child who was diagnosed with mild ADD ( not needing treatment) and discharged the same visit.

I do not know how countries compare in diagnostic criterior, but this may need to be taken into account for your decision also. I suspect that many milder cases of ADHD would simply not get Dx in UK there is a bit of a wait and see approach to avoid ?over diagnosis but it may also cause some to give up!!!.

So do you take DS1 to someone in Switz for assessment? Hmm , well you rightly said there are pros and cons! I can see that it would be quicker, less hassle,(several clinic appointments with long waits between are standard here)and both dcs would be dx under the same criterior/ treated the same if you take ds1 to ds 2 paed! You would also have earlier warning (if dx given) to help with school transfer.
There are many behaviour stratagies that work well for all children and may be helpful whatever you decide. Good luck- sorry to waffle!

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ernest · 24/01/2008 15:09

magso, thanks a lot for your post - very very helpful. blimey am at the palava it is /can be in UK!

I just phoned up child psych mid October, saw him approx every 2 weeks (well ds did not me, lol) and considering I forgot 1 appointment and was Christmas/New Year break, was 3 months from 1st phone call to dx.

SO I'll def. get ds1 checked out. He's def. not extreme case, if indeed he does get dx, but he has had problems in school re teachers pissed off with him at lack of attention/disorganisation etc etc and I'd rather know (and find out sooner and easily than wait and jump through hoops)

Shit, leaving this standard of healthcare behind is going to be a shock to the system

BTW does having such a dx mean ds(s) would posibly find it harder to be accepted to a school when we do return to UK?

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magso · 24/01/2008 16:52

From an educational point of view ADHD is rather a hot potato!
It is not on that important list education authorities use to define special education needs. So a child with dyslexia (which is on the list) or dyspraxia should be considered for support or for instance extra time in exams. A child whose listening difficulty is caused by hearing loss (on the list) may get help, but not the child whose listening is limited by inattention they cannot fully control. ADHD is not considered sen, but is put in the 'emotional and behavioural' bracket if behaviour is severely adversley affected. On the other hand a diagnosis can help guide teachers on how best to support a child and that can be invaluable.

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ernest · 24/01/2008 16:55

ah, interesting. So if eg dyspraxia dx, they are on a 'list', which gets them extra help? And does having a 'listed' dx help or hinder obtaining a place I wonder?

So ADHD is not officially an SEN?

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evenhope · 24/01/2008 17:42

Sorry, back at work, not ignoring you

Yes DS is under the care of a consultant paediatric psychiatrist. He used to see him twice a year but it's been a while since we've been. They warned us the meds may stunt his growth but as he's over 6ft tall I assume either they didn't or he'd have been ridiculously tall.

He is also dyspraxic, though not as badly as DS1 (who doesn't have ADHD but has something). He gets 1:1 help at school and extra time in exams.

I think for a state school to refuse to take a child with ADHD just because of it would be illegal under the DDA. Private schools are a law unto themselves.

There is a familial link with these conditions so if you are able to get DS1 checked out too then I would.

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magso · 24/01/2008 17:52

I dont know how a diagnosis affects getting a school place. I dont think state schools are allowed to discriminate, but private schools may. Frankly getting support in school for any child in the state system is difficult it all comes down to cost. It used to be that children with high level needs had a statement of special educational need detailing for example one to one teaching or special modifications or equipment (such as a keyboard), funded by the lea, and the schools own budget covered the lesser needs. So it was the children with milder needs who had to compete for the schools very limited budget. It is almost impossible to get a statement for a child for ADHD alone, just as it is for dyslexia etc unless you can proove the childs needs are high enough. However now there is a trend for schools being given a sen budget to cover all sen ( including the statemented children) giving them in theory more flexibility. It might actually be the children with statements (whose needs are specified and must by law be met) who are less welcomed in schools! Understanding of ADHD within schools is patchy, so it can be very much luck of the draw. Sorry longwinded again!

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ernest · 24/01/2008 17:52

ta. Seriously considering marching dh along as well, lol, if he isn't ADHD I'll eat my hat.

Called doc. Waiting for reply then will also make appt for ds1.

thanks for advice so far

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magso · 24/01/2008 18:06

Ah well ADHD often runs in families!Good luck!

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