4 month old - dropping 4th nap nightmare

[Littlef00t]

So I aim for bedtime around 7pm, and now she has a longer wake time, if she had a 4th nap, it would in theory be around 5:30pm, after being awake for about 2 hours but she often refuses to have it or is then not tired for bed.

If she doesn't, she's desperate for bed by 6pm, but then awake from 6am so everything comes forward an hour and is no better.

Any advice?

[DeffoJeffo]

We do a late nap at about 4.30/5pm. I wake my DS up from this so he is awake for 2 hours before his bed time. As he's got older it's got to just being a 10 minute nap and some days he misses it all together.

Good luck :)

[fledermaus]

What are your other nap times?

[Littlef00t]

She usually naps after being awake for just under 2 hours, first nap 1:30-2hrs, second 1 hour, 3rd nap 30mins.

so ish 8:45-10:30/10:45 12:30-1:30 3:30-4

4pm is just about doable to stretch to an early bedtime about 6:30, but sometimes her naps are shorter and she could have woken from her 3rd nap about 3:30.

The first three naps I can put her down awake, she'll protest but be asleep within 5 mins, 10 tops.

Today I tried another nap at 5:15 having been awake since 3:20 and looking tired and she cried, even when I picked her up for a cuddle until I gave up and took her out her gro bag. She ended up going to bed at 6:15 so I expect a nightmare morning as she doesn't need 13 hours.

Do you think I should persevere with the 4th nap? When I have managed to get to have one, it often doesn't make much of a difference and she's still tired, so I guess it's worth persevering with as it doesn't impact on bedtime.

[Littlef00t]

I wouldn't be able to do a nap at 4:30 as she's not tired enough, as she's just woken up an hour ago.

[fledermaus]

I'd try pushing her awake time between naps a bit, maybe just by 15 minutes, so the 3rd nap is later.

[Littlef00t]

Sounds like a plan. I'll check in tomorrow and say how it went.

[mrsmugoo]

I've had this exact thing - I have to "force" him to have a longer gap between naps - so we loosely aim for 9:30 / 1 / 4 if that's a stretch then it's 12:30 / 3:30

It's not great and I'm sure he is verging on overtired quite a bit but I can't seem to get him to take 4 naps and I don't want a 6pm bedtime because of the crazy early start.

I also have the problem that my DS is an arch catnapper. I had hoped his naps might stretch out once we dropped the 4th one, but no!

[Littlef00t]

Ha mrs mugoo, I agree it's a bit of a catch 22. Ended up putting her to bed at 6:15 pm as she was shattered, and she woke as bright as a daisy at 6am on the dot. So as the later 3rd nap is out, I'm aiming for a forced 4th nap, ideally by taking her out in the car or pram and putting her to bed after 7 this time.

That's my other problem, she was always good at waking at 7am, but as her night feeds inched forward, she wakes at 6am without fail (usually waking between 4:30 and 5:30, I usually feed her). Sometimes if I feed her she'll go back to sleep, but it takes a while of her jabbering to herself then if I wake her at 7 she's still tired, so roll on an earlyish nap and back to the 4th nap dilemma. If I let her sleep longer that works ok, but then I've not resolved the 6am wake up boo. Sure she's just waking out of habit, as she did this when she was younger but 6:45 so easier to ignore her til 7 as she wouldn't ramp up to crying in 15 mins.

[mrsmugoo]

I had to do a forced 4th nap yesterday as he fell asleep on the way home from lunch which is a 10 minute walk and only lasted 5 minutes stationary once I got home so 15 mins between 3-3:15 - nightmare!

I took him for a 40 minute walk at 5 and he dropped right off but ended up going to bed an hour later as was full of beans at bath time so today I have the opposite problem haha!

To be honest though he can function ok on 3 naps a day - they are generally 40 minutes with 2:20 wake time between, then does 12 hours in bed.

[Littlef00t]

Well yesterday was the least routine day since she was about a week old, rather freaky!

Up at 6am Her two morning naps were half their usual length and her third was about 20mins done by 2:30. She didn't seem at all tired after 2hrs 30 but i managed a sneaky 4th nap anyway that lasted all of 20mins again.

She is usually really cranky and crying but it was like she was on E numbers, laughing and really hyper til she eventually went to sleep at 8pm.

It was fun and strange but I'm relieved she's back to normal today.

[Littlef00t]

Mrs mugoo, I definitely think she can go longer than 2 hours now, it was 2:15 before her first nap today so will def stretch and distract in future.

[mrsmugoo]

I spoke to the HV about this yesterday and she said it's about this age (mine is 18 weeks) where it's ok to start to introduce more of a fixed routine if you've been completely baby led up to this point.

Babies thrive on routine and eventually they will come to expect sleeps at set times and their body clocks will gear up accordingly.

[TheresLotsOfFarmyardAnimals]

MRSMUGOO wow, look at your LO sleeping! I remember your thread from a while back!

Your HV is right too, DS has an internal clock! If we miss a meal/snack/sleep time he's a right grumpy so and so.

OP, I'd stick with the fourth night and put him down later but then 6am is not my favourite time of the day. I hate nap transitions!

[mrsmugoo]

I know, it's amazing! It's been about 2/3 weeks now since I started putting him in his cot for all sleeps and he's just got better and better. Almost sleeping through the night now and having all his naps in the cot when at home. Still catnapping, but still massive improvement of only sleeping on me. It's been a journey!

[Littlef00t]

Yay mrs mugoo, I have hope for dd sleeping more at night too.

Well I think the 4th nap is well and truly dropped. Whereas before she would be a mess come bedtime if she had been awake more than 2 hours, she can go 2 1/2 now and the earlier naps are inching forward to pick up the slack.

I'll start working on the early wakes when I'm back from hols in a week.

[mrsmugoo]

I have to basically reverse engineer my entire day around him taking his last nap at 4 in order to make the last stretch before bed bearable. He napped 3:45-4:15 today and we brought bath time forward and he was down for the night by 7:15

[Littlef00t]

Hmm that would be fine except her naps can be quite unpredictable, so some days she can nap total over 3 1/2 hours, some days it's more like 2.

To be honest things aren't such a nightmare now, I think she's past the worst.

I've got a week to ponder getting her to wake less at night before trying to crack that one. I can't decide how hard to be. I had to be quite 'mean' to get her to the state were at now where she will whine for a couple of minutes before dropping off for a nap at at bedtime, but night time wakings are a different story, although she doesn't seem hungry, it's either a quick feed or over 30 mins of fussing, rocking etc before she accepts it's still night time.

[mrsmugoo]

We we're out in the pushchair yesterday and so naps got a bit screwed up and he ended up having 4 sleeps and then was back to waking at 6:30am this morning....which means we are already on 3rd nap today and so will need another later.

Sigh

He's teething so I don't feel like battling him to stretch out his wake times today so I'm just going to have to suck it up...

[eastmidswarwicknightnanny]

I would advise longer lunchtime nap n have 3 naps.

So 9am for 45-60mins
11.45/12- 2/2.30 so a 2-2.5he
4.30/4.45 for 45mins

Then can continue with a 7pm bedtime

[mrsmugoo]

Ha! I'd kill for him to sleep 2.5 hours at lunch time and I have no doubt it would solve the issue but he sleeps 45 minutes tops.