How the hell is maths taught these days?

[coleslaw]

Hello. can anyone help explain how maths is taught these days. My DD struggles and doesn't understand 0-99 number squares but can happily do sums ie 52 + 52=104 for example, and can follow simple maths rules. She has never really understood a number line, finding it confusing. She is normally a very confident child, but the teachers seem to persist with these bloody number lines and squares, even though she can do all of her sums (with ease) in the old fashioned way, ie with one figure over the other.
.It is destroying her confidence and mine, too. We are happy to help her in whatever way we can but don't know where to start and can't seem to fathom what she SHOULD be learning. We just know she is below her age level in maths (despite being loads ahead in literacy). I feel utterly hopeless about it . Sorry for the ramble.

[MummyDoIt]

I believe that primary schools these days teach several different methods and it's up to the child to decide which one suits them best. I've seen different ways of doing multiplication and division. The 'old-fashioned' way is fine for some kids but not others. If your DD has found a way that works for her, I'd be speaking to the teachers to ask that she be allowed to use that.

Hopefully some primary school teachers will be along soon and explain it better!

[coleslaw]

Thankyou for the reassurance. I just feel that the teacher has decided that DD is pants at maths so there is no point even trying. We can see at home that this simply isn't true, but just don't know where to go from here.

[LynetteScavo]

There is a great book called "Maths for Mums and Dads" which explains how maths is taught naow, and the termioligy used in the class room. I can't remember who it's by, but it's for sale on line at The Book People.

[coleslaw]

Thankyou LS

[caen]

The idea now is that children should be taught to maipulate the numbers themselves and understand how it all works. If a child can add using the formal method, it does not mean that they understand why they are putting a 1 under the tens column etc. just that they should.

Using a number line helps them to add in their heads because they are learning to start with the larger number and add on in manageable chunks, splitting the number into hundreds, tens and units beforehand. I have taught lots of children who can use the formal methods taught at home but have no clue why they work. That's why schools hold off teaching the formal methods until later.

Ask the teacher what you can do to help your DD. The teacher should have an idea of the weaknesses and maybe lots of number line practice will help. In class they often don't have the time to really consolidate these skills, especially of they are struggling. I would do lots of number lines with her and ask her to explain each step to you and why she's doing it. Verbalising it herself will help her to understand better.
Hope that helps.

[MummyDoIt]

Just want to add that our school offers Information Evenings for KS1 and KS2 parents where we can go in and be given an overview of the teaching methods being used at each stage. They are very useful. If your school doesn't do this, it might be worth suggesting.

[florenceuk]

Ds always struggled with drawing those number line as he has very poor fine motor skills - he can do it a lot faster in his head. So last year, he got marked down because his number lines were extremely messy and illegible and indeed meant he got the answer wrong - this year (Y3) he is doing much better as they seem to have recognised the fact that he can actually do the problem, if not reproduce the method exactly.

What year is your DD - if she can add together two digit numbers then is she really behind in maths?

Also (although this wouldn't work for everyone) we found doing those exercise books in maths (the Bond series) quite good for confidence building - DS was always pleased to get his test right and I could see for myself that actually he did understand the basic principles and was at the right level for his age.

[throckenholt]

in a word - badly !

number lines and number squares may work for some - but like your DD my DS finds them baffling.

He is very mathematical in his approach to life - but struggles to make sense of the way maths is done at school - but at home can happily add 6 (or more figure numbers) in the old column method, can do long multiplication in the same way.

I try to go through it with him at home, explain about different methods to get to the answer, explain there is no right way - just use whichever method suits you. I think it is boosting his confidence (not doing much for my confidence in his teacher though !!)

[bellissima]

..don't get me started...

DD1 asked me what 'decomposition' was the other night. I thought at last! - an interest in science - and explained as best i could. "yeah but what's that got to do with subtraction mum??" - search me - I've only got maths A level. Then there's division by 'chunking' (something to do with chocolate bars??).

My only conclusion is that any modern method seems to involve the maximum possible use of ink on paper in order to solve one simple old fashioned sum

[throckenholt]

the current methods might help understanding of how to manipulate small numbers in simple situations - but they are incredibly cumbersome and easy to miss bits out if you try and extend it to more complicated numbers.

Simple question - how do number lines help when you are trying to do 145624-23566 ?!

[hatwoman]

true about maximm ink - for years 1 and 2 dd got marked down in maths for her blank refusal to write down her "jottings". she could do the sums - not just mechanically - she understood what was going on iyswim, but was damned if she was going to waste time/ink/effort on illustrating that to the teacher. finally in year 4 she did some cognitve ability tests and the head was shocked to see how good she was.

[throckenholt]

oh so simple !!

[peacocks]

I agree with throckenholt.

Do NOT listen to the teacher if she tells you to abandon these methods at home. I did and the result was utter confusion and mediocrity.

I've just written this on another thread that I've just intensively (re)taught my ds ten to the top, one to the bottom etc, and all the old methods that I used. He doesn't understand them and neither do I and I recently completed OU MST 121 Maths. It doesn't matter. My ds understands numbers -- so does your child, it would seem. My ds (10) now uses these tools to do fractions and algebra and geometry. He's no longer confused and quite frankly he's pretty proud of himself. He's good at maths too. But patterns and magic squares, just rubbish imo.

[peacocks]

Chunking is the work of the devil.

FUCKING WASTE OF TIME

[peacocks]

SORRY BUT BEEN WAiting years to say that

[SE13Mummy]

I'm a primary teacher but I'm not sure I'm going to be able to make you feel any better about what's going on at your DD's school.

You need to ask for a copy of the school's 'written calculations policy' which will detail the methods they will teach at various stages/ages. This should include examples so you can see exactly what's going on.

However, the new-fangled methods are all very well and good for teaching place value, helping children to visualise numbers in order and the like but I personally believe that some children actually benefit from calculating first and understanding second so for me, when I encounter children who can add two digit numbers accurately but make a mess of it when using partitioning or numberlines then I would teach them the 'short formal method' (aka the old fashioned way). All the other methods work towards this one as it's the most efficient. Unfortunately, in a drive to improve understanding of number (which I do think is a valid ideal) some schools have lost sight of the fact that we want to produce numerate children and, to be honest, it really doesn't matter which method a child uses so long as it a) makes sense b) can be explained by the child and c) is accurate and efficient.

I would recommend the Target maths books by Stephen Pearce (KS2 only I think but might be useful for your DD) as they give clear, worked examples and are referenced to the units and blocks of the primary strategy.

Whereabouts are you Coleslaw? I love teaching maths to maths-haters (because it's something I never saw the point of until I studied statistics) so if you're in SE London let me know!

[southeastastra]

i think it's totally confusing now. ds struggles yet i can't help him as i was taught differently! pees me right off.

[throckenholt]

I think SE13Mummy is right - the idea is to aid understanding - but it seems that for some schools/teachers the methods have overtaken the aim and they seem determined you have to do it the new way because it is better. But they don't seem to be able to think on their feet when they get children for whom it doesn't help, and don't seem to try other strategies.

In maths there are numerous ways of getting to the answer and "it really doesn't matter which method a child uses so long as it a) makes sense b) can be explained by the child and c) is accurate and efficient." is really the only important thing.

Actually - the most important thing is that the child is happy that they know what they are doing and have the confidence in their skill to do it.

From my experience confidence is a huge factor in mathematical ability - and once you have lost it, it is really hard to turn things around and build it again (very rewarding when you see the dawning understanding on someone's face though ).

[CardyMow]

If my DS's primary school is anything to go by, they give the top Y3 maths group homework that involves bigger multiplications (49x81), having NOT shown the DC's how to do long multiplication, and expecting the parents to show them....He said he was shown how to do easy sums by partitioning (?!anyone?!) but it only made sense with smaller numbers, and the remark my 7yo DS said was "wouldn't it take forever to do a sum like this with partitioning?" HE explained partitioning to me (good god is there a longer winded way of doing what is essentially a very simple sum??) I showed him how to do long multiplication, he did all 10 problems correctly after I explained the first one . I spoke to his class teacher, who said "oh it was just a sort of test to see where the children were at,we don't usually teach long multiplication until Y5" But how can a teacher expect to gain a good idea of what the children are capable of if they haven't taught them things that they are obviously capable of IYSWIM.

[princessparty]

I like the new maths methodswhich enable a child to understand how numbers work and to do calculations mentally rather than on paper.Could your DC add together 6-digit numbers metally using the old ways of learning ? Since I've learned the new ways I can do it quicker than I can punch it into a calculator