DS driving teacher mad - help!

[NorksandSpencer]

Had a chat with my DS (8) teacher this week. Basically he's driving her nuts and she didn't have anything nice to say about him other than that he's bright and doing well academically.

Whilst I'm a little upset and a bit disappointed in the terms and manner in which she talked about him, I do have a lot of sympathy with her complaints and wondered if anyone has any tips on how I might help DS be less annoying to her and, in turn to us . You may wonder why it matters because he's doing fine but it matters to me that she seems not to like him and it matters to me that he's always been like this and getting older doesn't seem to be improving it.

He drives us nuts at home too and whilst he does have friends, a lot of his peers find him annoying cos he's a bit "me,me,me" and has to dominate everything e.g. at football, he has to be the one to kick-off, the one to take all corners/throws, the one to do 3 cheers at the end - you get the picture

Issues in class are:

• never stops talking
  
• calls out answers when it's someone else's turn
  
• finishes the teacher's sentences for her when she's addressing the class
  
• has to sit entirely on his own because he distracts others
  
• is over-familiar with the teacher and doesn't seem to respect boundaries, her position as an adult/teacher etc
  
• always rushing to finish - needs to be first to complete even if the quality of work suffers
  
• has to know what everyone else has scored in tests - very competitive
  

All of this has been an issue since Reception - so he's on his 4th teacher and none of them has managed to sort him out and neither have we despite constant reminders to wait while others are speaking, say excuse me etc etc.

All suggestions gratefully received....

[StripiestSocks]

Erm, not a good attitude IMO. What discipline methods is she using? How boring are her lessons? What responsibility did she take for any solutions?

Basically either this can be improved or it can't. If it can't be improved by normal teaching methods then someone needs to start thinking about deeper reasons. It is unacceptable to basically 'not like' a young child - even if he doesn't one should be capable of remaining professional.

I would see the head. I would not be at all happy about such negative labelling. I am not saying there aren't issues but it is very unsupportive language. The school should be pressing for assessments if there is a reason behind his inability to, for example, respect our boundaries. Or hey should be asking to work with you if they think it is just bad behaviour. They can not simply be unconstructive.

[ChiefOwl]

Does he have siblings? How do they take us me, me, me?

[GreatUncleEddie]

What sanctions have been tried? He's old enough to moderate his behaviour, given an incentive.

[StripiestSocks]

Have you considered any assessments to determine whether he can't or won't wait his turn for example?

[simbo]

Has he been assessed for adhd? Some of the things you say would have flagged up an assessment by the senco at my children's school.

[StripiestSocks]

I agree, has SENCO had any input at all?

[BackforGood]

I'd have thought by 8 you should be able to talk to him about how his attitude has started to, or will start to impact on his friendships - perhaps focusing on the footbal to start with.
ds is instinctively like this... to some extent it is part of his personality, but I always felt it was part of my job, as his Mum to make sure he doesn't dominate in situations where I was there.

[ohfunnyhoneyface]

I think you're being very realistic and honest, OP. other posters have me raising my eyebrows. Can you imagine how irritating that child in the class could be? Seeing him upset and override quieter members? The desire to be centre of attention can be very tiring.

What sanctions do you use when he interrupts you, OP? Does he understand how others feel when he talks over them? Does he seem sympathetic to their feelings?

[StripiestSocks]

I am well aware how tiring/annoying it is to have bad behaviour in the classroom, but either he can help it - in which case the school should be talking about sanctions etc - or he can't - in which case they need to consider SN. It is unacceptable for a teacher to basically say they don't like a child but not have any ideas what to do.

For example, he should be sent out of the room if he is persistently ignoring the teacher. Surely the school has a system? If not there is an issue with the school. If it does have a system but the teacher is not using it, then the issue is the teacher. Schools need to be able to handle behaviour where parents are not interested at all, so with an engaged parent it should be possible to make progress.

[NorksandSpencer]

Thanks for the replies, I NC for this post because I'm a fairly regular poster on the SN board too and didn't want the combo of info about my DS and DD to out me but I'll try to answer the Qs

ChiefOwl we have 2 DC. DD is 3yrs younger than DS but has a significant learning disability due to a genetic condition (unique to her, no-one else in family affected). This means that developmentally she's like a 2 year old so in many ways she's no challenge to DS in terms of him having to share toys with her etc. OTOH she takes up a lot of mine and DH's time and is the source of a lot of angst and stress.

Stripies thanks for your supportive reply. This teacher has a rep for talking straight, being tough etc but also as a brilliant teacher in terms of helping DC progress, especially those who come into her class struggling academically. I thought she'd be good for my DS and be the one to sort him out in terms of his in-class behaviour but it feels like she's not able to sort it any more than his previous teachers could and, possibly because she's used to strong discipline in her class, is finding him really annoying. I don't know, I'm speculating!

She's tried loss of playtimes, loss of golden time, notes home (which we've always responded to). TBH we thought things had improved because we'd not heard anything for a while but clearly they haven't.

In previous years we've also had issues with overly aggressive play as well as this impulsiveness in the classroom but with maturity and a few changes of kids in the class, the playground stuff appears to have been sorted. We've had behaviour books for him in Yrs 1 and 2 because of the playground stuff and have always been proactive in talking to school about the issues we perceived. In Reception and Yr 1, I raised the issue of ADHD and I posted on here about it too (under a diff name) but the consensus seemed to be that it wasn't that and, as he's matured, I'm pretty certain that it isn't that. His Reception teacher said he was just a really boyish boy and she really liked that about him .

[JuliaScurr]

simbo yep

Try SENCO

and my favoiurite //youngminds.org

[NorksandSpencer]

Oooh lots of replies whilst I was typing the last missive . Thanks everyone.

We have talked to him about this, about how annoying and unfair it is for others. We've used specific examples of quieter children in his class along the lines of "you know how you like answering questions and getting them right? well so does X and, because you're always shouting out, they don't get a chance. that must be annoying for them mustn't it?". He seems to get it, agrees it must be annoying and then doesn't change.

To me, it's as if the impulse to be first, to dominate overrides all the lovely bits and all the empathy that I know is in there. He's not a nasty or unsympathetic child, not vindictive etc but just seems to have to dominate any situation.

We did talk to SENCO in Yr 2 about the overly aggressive play but her opinion was that there were far worse behaved children in the school and that I was over-anxious. She did put in place a home/school diary where his teacher recorded how he was doing and as I have said, the playground issues appear to be resolved.

[ohfunnyhoneyface]

Interesting- I've taught a boy very similar to your son who also had an SEN sibling (older in this case) and he saw a play therapist who helped him a with working out his behaviour issues.

Is that worth trying whilst your son is young enough to respond? As he gets older it will obviously be harder to break the 'habits' and teenagers are notoriously difficult at opening up about their feelings.

[StripiestSocks]

I'm a fan of young minds too. Do you think he could have emotional issues relating to his sibling's back story? He has had plenty to deal with.

I really would ask for a meeting with the head. Tell her you are not happy with the labelling, you want a plan to tackle things etc, SN needs ruling out and a compassionate plan going forward.

Hope you get it sorted, must be hard for him and for you.

[werewolvesdidit]

Boys are competitive. He sounds very able and possibly isn't being stretched enough. What about a challenging open-ended project that he can work on in class when he's done his work and behaved well (subject of his own choosing). He obviously enjoys being clever so capitalise on it (ex teacher in boys' school here). His behaviour sounds normal (although annoying :) to me).

[StripiestSocks]

I agree a play therapist or similar could be a good option. Sorry to be blunt but could you afford something quickly and privately?

[NorksandSpencer]

Thanks for all the suggestions and good wishes. I'm getting emotional here . I often wonder if what's happening at home is a factor (having DD has had a pretty devastating impact on our marriage for example) but then I look back and he's always been like it

I'll have a think over the weekend but at the moment I'm wondering if first off I need to have another chat to the teacher and see how much of a problem it really is and whether she thinks it's worthy of investigation. I'd rather feel that I've involved her to the maximum extent before I involve the Head.

And in the interests of fairness in case I gave the wrong impression, she didn't say she didn't like him, just didn't have anything positive to say and was pretty animated in the things that were annoying - does that make it any better at all?

I'll also have another chat to him and make sure that we are being consistent in not accepting talking over us or other people in our presence.

My hunch is it's behaviour not SN but I'm no expert obviously.

Thanks so much for your input everyone.

[StripiestSocks]

I understand how devastating something like an ill child or SN can be. It is tough on you all. Just give him a big hug now and have a good think over the weekend. And have a or too. I bet you'll work it out.

[ohfunnyhoneyface]

The more you say the more convinced I am that talking to someone will help figure out his feelings. It sounds like his behaviour is rooted in his self perception (the overly competitiveness, treatment of others etc) and a good play therapist will be able to help him work through that, without it being 'therapy'.

[NorksandSpencer]

Just to answer the last couple of posts.

werewolves he's bright but not exceptional. top sets for everything but not top of the top iyswim. I could ask, but I don't think this teacher would be up for rewarding his constant race to be first

Stripies we're paying for so much private therapy for our DD that I'm sure adding a play therapist for DS won't make much difference Seriously, I would find the money for this if I thought it would help the situation and uncover any underlying emotional stuff. His behaviour at home can be pretty teenage like (tantrums, door slamming) and I do look ahead and worry about what he'll actually be like as a teenager if he's like this now.

Anyone know where I'd find such a person?

[NorksandSpencer]

Thanks for and to be honest I usually turn to in times of need but that's a whole other thread

The link upthread for Young Minds is taking me to a site that just has a lot of links to other websites - is that correct?

Thanks again all for the support and I will follow up with play therapy as well as talking to school etc.

Any recommendations for play therapists gratefully received.

And can I just add [bconfused] for no other reason than that I've just spotted the Burns night smileys and love this one!

[StripiestSocks]

Just google youngminds.org.uk they have a parents helpline. You phone, tell a call handler what's up then someone gets back to you, a trained young people's MH specialist, you get a long call and they advise. I have used it twice, very helpful.

I think the hardest bit is finding a counsellor, I'm sorry. Do you have trusted professionals you could ask for recommendations?

Have a [bbiscuit] then maybe? That may not be helping, just chuck it back if not.

[Bobyan]

He sounds like my husband when he was young, he has been diagnosed with ADD as an adult...

[StripiestSocks]

Just tried the link up thread, no that's not right, you need .org.uk to find the right one.

[ohfunnyhoneyface]

www.bapt.info/findaqualifiedplaytherapist.asp

I would use the British association of play therapists to find a good one.