Introducing carb refeeds

[StuntNun]

I have been on a low carb way of eating for nearly a year. I have reached my target weight and my BMI is 21 but I'm still carrying a fair bit of flab around the lower abdomen, bum and thighs. My current aim is to lose fat but gain muscle so that I don't lose much if any any weight but my body fat percentage drops a little lower. With that in mind I have started exercising and have already seen some improvements such as visible muscle in my legs and tightening up of my bingo wings. I am also toying with carb refeeds which can apparently trigger a boost in the release of leptin which signals your brain that there is plenty of food available so it doesn't need to hang on to extra fat stores. Has anyone used carb refeeds in this way to promote body recompositioning to a lower body fat percentage?

[Fourarmsv2]

I did one to break a plateau but I'm now in a similar position - happy with my weight but want to lose my saddle bags and bingo wings so will follow this with interest :)

[StuntNun]

Mark's Daily Apple has some info on carb refeeds. I tried one today but I don't know whether I ate enough carbs as I'm usually pretty low. I had my usual scrambled eggs for breakfast. Lunch was low fat-moderate carb: Moroccon chicken breast, carrot/parsnip/turnip mash and sweetcorn followed by a glass of milk and a banana. Dinner was a peppered pork chop with microwaved leeks. So overall a lot lower on fat and a lot higher in carbs than I normally eat. As of this morning I'm currently at my lowest weight since records began so it will be interesting to see how the next few days pan out.

[StuntNun]

So my higher carb day probably wasn't high enough, it only came in at 140g carbs where I should have been aiming for 300g for it to be a proper refeed. My weight today is the same as yesterday so I haven't increased my glycogen stores. I'm going to leave it for a few days then try another refeed with higher carbs.

[Fourarmsv2]

I might try one again soon - my last one was months ago and I'm very low carb normally.

[StuntNun]

I have used them successfully to break a stall before Fourarms, usually when the scales haven't budged for a while but my tummy has gone very squishy suggesting the fat has gone but been replaced with water weight. I had a whoosh a couple of days ago and my tummy went from jiggly to firm overnight.

[miffy49]

I'd be interested to know more about this. I'm at a loss as to how to break a very long standing stall. If anything my weight seems to be creeping up slightly as is my blood glucose. I was pre-diabetic with a few readings that slipped into the diabetic range and LCHF was the only thing that brought it down. Simple calorie counting/weight loss wasn't enough. I have lost 50lbs over a long period but my weight has stuck now for months and I have around 35lb to lose. I'm scared to reintroduce carbs in case I gain weight and I don't really like carbs anymore anyway so I don't know what I could add in! The only carb I actually miss is sugar and I'm not going down that track again!

[StuntNun]

Miffy here is the Mark's Daily Apple article that got me into the carb refeed. I lost 30 lb last year between June and November but I couldn't get below 9 st 6 lb until this Bootcamp when the scales started to creep down again and I've lost 2-3 lb over the past five weeks.

After my carb refeed yesterday my appetite seems to be less. I didn't really fancy lunch and ended up eating it at 3 p.m. The theory is that upping your carbs boosts your leptin levels (leptin is released by fat cells and signals the brain how much stored fat is available). So your brain gets a message that food is freely available and it doesn't need to preserve the fat stores at all costs.

[StuntNun]

Also here's some info about blood glucose in low carbers Miffy.

[Seri77]

Also interested in this as I've had an unplanned carb refeed due to D&V bug last week. For three days I was only able to stomach one meal of plain pasta. Miffy I agree, carbs aren't very nice any more. The only things I could still go for are desserts like creme brûlée and cheesecake. I've even lost the taste for cake.

I got under 11 stone for the first time when I weighed on Monday but I don't know if I was still dehydrated. My appetite hasn't increased. I haven't fallen into a pile of doughnuts. My tummy feels squishy so I'm hoping more fat will go.

[StuntNun]

I find rice, carrots and potatoes are a real treat now. Sweet potato and butternut squash would probably be nice too. But I don't think I could go back to eating bread and sugar. On my birthday I went to Wagamamas and ate a quarter of a portion of rice which I really enjoyed but I don't think I could have managed the whole portion.

I have found that I don't react badly to cheat meals any more now I am at maintenance. That's probably because I still don't go overboard on the carbs, even intentionally eating carbs yesterday I only got to 140g so not even enough to start refilling my glycogen stores. The cheats I have had (not while on Bootcamp obviously) have been the likes of a few chips or roast spuds or rice. They don't cause a weight gain the next day but they do leave me hungrier than usual on the second day.

[StuntNun]

Seri when I had a tummy bug earlier in the year I was hitting the carbs too but my overall calories for the day were still very low so I wasn't too worried. The first thing I craved in recovery was apple juice and the second thing was toast so I decided to assume my body knew what it was doing and had them. I have noticed since starting low carb that I don't seem to get as ill which I attribute to being able to freely access my fat stores so I don't get as weak when I can't eat.

[Seri77]

Between bootcamps I tried a little bit of rice, pasta, noodles, oatcakes on a couple of occasions. They did nothing for me, I never finished a portion. Sweet potatoes and proper roast potatoes are still yum, but a small portion is enough.

Stuntnun my overall calories will be low. I never felt hungry even when I didn't eat for 48 hours so expect the fat stores were in use. I'm only just up to 2 small meals per day now and still not really interested in food. I'm hoping to keep the no snacking pattern once I'm fully recovered.

[StuntNun]

I'm glad you're on the mend Seri. When I was ill I did lose a bit of weight and it stayed off which would suggest it was fat stores that I lost rather than breaking down lean body mass.

[miffy49]

Stuntnun thanks for the links. the BG one makes me wonder if I should actually bother to worry about my fasting BG going up a bit. It does just seem to be dawn phenomenon as its OK during the day and its OK if I check it if I need the loo just before my normal wake up time. It goes up in the time between then and me getting downstairs. It did seem to have stopped but its been tending to go up since around March time and I can't think of any reason why other than that I have been very LC trying to break this stall. May be going the wrong way about it!

I'm a bit scaredy-cat about adding carbs back. I was reading a book last night called The Dissident Dieter. The person who wrote that advocate a similar plan to BC then, after two wks uses what we would see as BC light for five days a week with a treat day followed by a day similar to ubercamp. The treat day is supposed to more sensible carbs rather than 'stuff yourself silly'! I'm so scared that I will regain weight with the carbs and then not be able to shift that either!

Sorry, I'm whinging!! I'll go hide now!

[PeonyStick]

miffy don't run and hide - I am a scardey cat too .... I have just reached target weight for now and want to maintain . I am very happy on a low carb diet - and have experimented with a few things that I have missed - mainly fruit occasionally . I really have no interest in bread/pasta/potatoes now but a small amount alcohol ..... That seems to cause a fall in the scales .
It's sooo interesting . I am also doing a HiT class with weights ( a sort of high energy circuits) which is having amazing effect on my tum but my legs remain trunk like !

[miffy49]

Dipped a toe in this morning with a bit of gluten free toast. Its only taking my carbs up to aroung 30 for today but I normally only eat around 10g so its quite daring for me! Wish Imcould try the HIIT that everyone is enthusing about but its not an option for me. Have increased my weight reps a bit though so achey tonight.

[PeonyStick]

I think the resistance work is the key tbh - the HIt just makes it work a bit quicker , building muscle is the main aim .

[miffy49]

Well, I followed Stuntnun's advice and had a day with some carb. I followed the carb day with a day of ubercamp and in about 4 days I have finally dropped nearly 2lbs!

I'm with you on resistance work PeonyStick. I've gone back to being conscientious with my weights and my blood glucose has dropped nicley too.

I'm a happy little bunny today but now I just need to keep the scales going in this direction. Thats the hard bit!

[CharlieLf]

Hi ladies, this article might be useful.

www.bodybuilding.com/fun/cyclical_ketogenic_diet.htm

[olivesnutsandcheese]

Interesting article from Charlie. Does anyone know how this could work using bootcamp/bclite principles?
Do you think it would get those last pesky pounds off.

[miffy49]

I'm on my own little experiment. I'm doing a day with a few quality carbs followed by a very strict day like uber camp with basically meat/eggs very low carb veg and no dairy to get rid of any glycogen stores and then the rest of the week on normal Bootcamp. On the 5 Bootcamp days I have cut cheese but still having one small serving of Greek yoghurt with cream. Only done one week as yet but I've lost for the first time in months and months. Fingers crossed I can keep losing as it would seem fairly painless.

[olivesnutsandcheese]

How close to your target are you Miffy? I'm fairly close to mine I think but can't quite decide if my body is happy as it is (hence the stalling or just maintaining) or whether I could do something like carb re feed to help get things moving.
My weight is roughly 10 stone at 5'8 but there are some annoying very squishy areas I'd like to reduce. The trouble is if I think and plan too much about it then that's normally when I start to self sabotage and go off the rails again. I guess I could just try some carbs like butternut squash for one meal or lentils and then eat normal bootcamp the rest of the week. I'll be interested to hear how your regime works though

[miffy49]

I still have a way to go. I've lost 50lbs over a very long time but still have around 35lbs to go. I'm still wavering in and out of the obese BMI range. that's why it didn't make sense to be stalling. I can understand it when people get close to target. I'm not aiming super-thin. I don't think it looks good when you are older but it would be kinder to my joints to get more off. I keep a check on the Fat Secret site and my calories and percentages are OK so it has to be a metabolic thing.

[StuntNun]

I think we each have to find what works for us. I did very well on Bootcamp and Bootcamp Light but I don't think they will get me where I want to be. Experimenting with different macros ratios, carb refeeds, carb cycling and exercise is a good way forward for me at this point. I have lost enough weight and learned a lot about how different foods affect me. Ideally I think I will end up eating low carb on the whole but not worrying about the occasional extra carby day but without adding sugar and processed foods back into my diet. I don't want to get into a complex system of carb cycling and having to plan my calories and macros in meticulous detail, my life is complicated enough without that!

[miffy49]

No. I only monitored mine to see if I could pick up on what I was doing wrong. Isn't it the Diet Doctor who says counting your food is a form of disordered eating? I just got so desperate as my weight loss slowed right down and eventually stopped. I was actually still losing bits until I tried 5:2. I was taken by the idea of supposedly being able to eat a more mixed diet and still get the same effect. That stopped the loss altogether and messed up my cholesterol, blood glucose and blood pressure! I went back to keto and got my BP and cholesterol back to something sensible but still struggled with the weight. I'll stick with the LCHF regardless as its the only thing that helps my fibro-addled brain work and its worth it just for that. Some more weight loss would be wonderful though.