Questions about living in Australia

[99redballoons]

Hi, the dismal cold holidays have got us thinking about moving to Australia. We have friends that moved to Perth last year and are loving it. I have family in Queensland. Dh & I have never been to Australia, even though everyone in our close family have been and rave about it.

My questions to you are, what is the weather like across the county? Which places get too hot and which are more like the UK? Is there a happy medium? I guess I'm thinking more of the big cities.

What is the politics like and actual living in Aus? eg. healthcare system, taxes, utilites etc.? Is it always a case of 'the grass is greener' or would living in Aus really be 'nicer' than living in the UK?

What is the schooling like? We have 2dc's, our eldest only just started school this year. We would have to move from where we are in the UK anyway for a decent secondary school (our catchment primary school is very good though) so thought if emmigration was a possibility it would be atleast 2-4 years away.

What are the house prices like? Is Aus having a housing market boom like we are? Have we missed the boat or are house prices still 'good' over there compared to in the UK?

Sorry for all the questions. It's all research atm. I would greatly appreciate your comments. TIA

[MrsBigD]

Hi 99redballoons, we're making the move in May To Sydney - where it can get pretty hot. my friend in Brisbane is generally well-medium baked during summer months...

What I've found out so far in summary:

Perth (where I've visited) is very nice indeed, and I think the climate is more moderate. However has the 'problem' that it's miles from any other bigger city in Australia.

Schools in general seem relatively good. I've contacted a few in Sydney (Northern) and class sizes are a max of 20 students with lots of outdoor. 'foreign' kids might be hit by fees though even for the state schools. We're lucky because dd and ds have dual nationality and as NZ citizens they don't have to pay.

Healthcare: depends on which visa you go in whether you are entitled to medicare or not. I'm not so I have to take out private health insurance.

Politics ... no idea except that my friend who lives in Brisbane seems to be very very happy that they had a change in Prime Minister.

Taxes... if you convince the tax office that you are only there temporarily you might be entitled to some exemptions

Utilities seem to be more or less like here except that there are some monopolies

Not sure about cost of buying houses, but I've looked at renting. Seems about the same as here, but I'm looking at better quality of life, i.e. better weather = more time outside = can go for slightly smaller place etc. also prices vary greatly on where you are and whether it's close to trains/busses etc.

I got myself Sydney Explorer: The Complete Residents' Guide (Living and Working for Expats): The Complete Residents' Guide and it has some good general information. And of course there is the knowlegable Australian MN contingent

here's my latest thread

If you do a search for my username under Living Overseas it'll throw up a few more

HTH

[99redballoons]

Hi MrsBigD, thanks so much for your reply. You must be very excited about the move in May! Will check out your thread.

I've been struck down by the dreaded lurgy so I haven't had the chance to do any more research since my OP. I can see there are quite a few more threads on MN, bookmarked a few other websites to look at when I'm feeling better. Will watch your thread with interest to see how your move goes!

[speak2deb]

I lived in NZ for 7 years and some friends just moved back from Sydney after a year because they hated it so much.

Here's my opinions, for what they're worth :

Weather: varies enourmously across the country. Australia is HUGE. You'll find that the distance between Perth and your rellies
in Queensland will mean that you won;t see them very often. Adeleide has a nice UK-ish climate.

Politics: One of the reasons that my friends moved back to the UK is because Australia is, on the whole, quite a racist country. Before I get jumped on- by no means are all Australians racist, but the culture can be very hard to take. I have a friend of Sri Lankan heritage who lives there who's been subject to some very racist comments.

House prices: If you want to move to Sydney- forget it. Houses in half decent areas are more expensive there than in London. Perth might be more affordable tho'.

Oh- and I hope you don;t want to have any more children while you're over there- there is no statutory right to paid maternity leave in Oz.

There- rant over.

[chloeb2002]

hello been in bris since november but lived in sydney and melbourne for 5 years a few years ago. mostly we choose bris becuse we can afford to buy acreage here and not in sydney and bris is more of a big town than a city. Sydeny is the most beutifull city and has everything buut it does come at a price. Bris seems to have most things you could ever want or need. We live north of bris in the country but it is still only an hour to the city for dh to get to work. Public transport is much better than in the Uk cheap and reliable. House prices are rising all over australia just depends what lifestyle you want. we are looking at buying acreage and have found an area that is inland and about an hour from bris where we acn buy 30 acres with a five bedroom house on it for about 180gbp. couldnt do that in uk.
i would advise if you can come on a holiday first and vistit areas you think you might like. aus is huge! weather is varied perth at the moment is very very hot. adelaide has had some hot days too. melboure can be all seasons in one day, sydney i found warm in summer and cool in winter and so far bris has been the same just higher humidity.
As temp residents you pay loads of tax and cant claim anyting back. *well very little.
If you have children here and are a pem res you do get $4000 baby bonus so thats not to be sniffed at. If you shop wisely you can save alot on uk grocerys especially fresh fruit veg and meat. our normal grocery bill averages $120 a week for three of us.
healthcare well i am a nurse so probably biased but at least there is a good private system so treatment is availiable and affordable. The public sector is definately in better shape tahn the uk at least here they can afford to employ nurses (will now get off my soap box)
so moving to aus depends why and what you want out of it i guess. we ahve a few friends moving this way hopefully for the right reasons or they may all go back to the quickly. great place for kids to grow up. good schools, great outdoor life (even in the rain dd is out playing) great food and most places close to a major city for culture and similar stuff.

[sandcastles]

speak2deb, can I dispell the myth that Adelaide has a UK ish climate...

It is 40 today, getting upto to 42, maybe 43 by the end of the week.

I have been here 18 months & find the climate nothing like the UK.

[sandcastles]

speak2deb is right, there is no statortory maternity pay, but you do get the $4000 baby bonus once baby is born [if you are perm residents].

I am currently pregnant and have a 4 yr old dd. I have never worked here, [so no paid mat leave doesn't effect us] although dh does. We get well looked after by the government with parenting payment, an additional boster because I don't work, additional boster as dh is considered on a low wage [which we don't think he is, but hey!] We are also given rent assistance, which give us x amount a week towards rent.

They do look after you here, better than the UK, I feel. So while you don't get paid maternity leave, you do get other benefits that outweigh that.

Yes, there is a great outdoor life, but please consider that some days it is just too hot to go out, even into the garden!

43 last week & I was finding it hard just hanging the washing out. But that is fairly rare. Still something to consider tho.

[thequeenofcontradiction]

Hi, we moved to Perth a couple of months ago, as permanent residents, so I'm quite new at all this.

The weather has been very hot lately - quite a few days over 40 degrees. Whilst you do get used to the heat, those really hot days can be hard to take and we generally end up mopng around the house with the aircon on high.

House prices in Perth are, unfortunately, ridiculous. We decided to emigrate here in the hope that we could buy a house much quicker than in the UK (we lived in an especially pricey area of SW London), but we have been priced out of the market as first-time buyers. The housing boom seems to have peaked, and now houses are on the market much longer and apparently vendors are accepting offers much lower than the asking price. However if you have sufficient equity in the UK you might be OK.

I don't know anything about schools (DS is only 15mo), other than that the state schools vary widely in their quality. As in the UK, the schools in the better areas have a much better reputation, but you will pay dearly with regards to house prices. We are probably going to send DS private as I am a bit of an academic snob.

There are a lot of things I dislike about Perth. Due to the mining boom, lots of people have made lots of cash and they aren't afraid to let you know it. I'm not into wealth so money talk bores me. I also don't like being asked by virtual strangers how much I earn or how much I paid for my car/TV/loaf of bread. But that's just me.

TV is awful, the radio stations play a disturbing amount of Dire Straits, and I've never been able to catch up with Neighbours since arriving. But the sun almost always shines, the beaches and parks are beautiful and I'm sure my DS will grow up to be healthier and happier here. It's a trade-off, but I can live with it for now.

[99redballoons]

Hi everyone. Thanks for your comments. Lots to think about. I guess I'm mostly worried that if we do move out there and find it's not for us, that we won't be able to afford to buy a house back in the UK again! This needs alot more planning and thought that I first reckoned. As mentioned I think we definitely need a holiday out there to see what the different cities are like. Now ds is at school though, I'm not sure how we could take him out of school for this...

[chloeb2002]

I guess and my dh will shoot me for saying this but i would take ds away for three weeksa and a fly round aus. I presume he is in reception? or just started I am sure if you explain the reason you will have no problems just take some extra books and stuff the experince of a different country/ animals/ foods must be as good as early primary? just my view a big move to make and to get a reasonable price for the trip aviod the school holidays. Oh just a mention if you do fly into either bris or sydney first we used an airline called etihad for the first time after many trips with singapore and although not as wow as singapore the flight was raelly good, staff fab, food ok and more imoprtantly cheaper by far.

[SnowWhiteinOz]

If you are unsure I would second what Chloeb2002 says and try and come out on a visit first for a few weeks. Expensive maybe but cheaper than moving out here and hating it straight away.

Regarding the house (if you can afford to) maybe rent it our for 6-12 months so you have something to fall back on. Some may argue it is a cop out but it gives you some security if that is what you are worried about.

We have been here (in Adelaide) for over 3 months and love it so far - even like the hot days (although from inside with the aircon on!

[Oceana]

Hmmm, I thought I should respond as after reading this thread I have been left with a rather negative impression of Oz. I am living in Sydney permanently now (as of the start of this year) but, despite being a Londoner, I know Australia very well and have lived in Melbourne and Perth at various points in my life and my parents are living in Perth. Yes, there are negatives here but I think the positives massively outweigh them. The difference in lifestyle over here to that in the UK is astounding. Life is easier and much less stressful over here. People are friendly and gasp happy! Yes television is awful but (and I say this as a someone who was verging on telly addiction!) I think this is a great thing. At first I hated it but now I realise that you just don't watch it. People are actually outside enjoying life, activity, socialising, chatting to their family and friends rather than wasting it in front of the telly every night. Yes, there is racism and sexism over here but it is a sad fact that it is everywhere. I was recently in a pub in Dorset with a black friend of mine and he was told to leave... the 'N' word was used. As anywhere, it depends who you choose to associate with and where you live as to whether you will encounter these prejudices. The Eastern states tend to be a bit more progressive than the west.
One thing that does bother me is the general bad spelling and grammar. (This is a side effect of the Australian confusion over whether to follow the American lead or the British) I have decided that I will just have to drum proper English spelling into my DS from a very early age!
I think the main issue to consider is whether you are a homesicky type of person. Australia is a long way away and if that bothers you then that could be a deal breaker. Otherwise, I really think Australia is a fantastic place to live. I am British and I love the UK with all my heart and I miss it (and of course my friends and family over there) but my husband and I are so happy here. I know it is the best place for my little boy to grow up too.

[AussieSim]

I am an Aussie, but have lived in Germany and have travelled all over the world. I was a HR Director for a Global Consulting Firm and recruited lots of expats to all the capital cities around Australia and NZ and married one of them. I have a good knowledge of relo, immigration and tax as a result, though it is a challenge to keep it up to date while I am popping out babies.

There is no friendlier place then here. I have often heard tell from people from the UK about the distinct class based society back there and while we still have 'haves and have nots' it is not as prominent as in older more traditional countries.

I grew up in the Hunter Valley of NSW which is a couple of hours from Sydney and these days is a tourist destination. It is true that the further you get away from the big cities the more ignorant people can be - I think that is probably true of most countries.

Sydney can get hot, but it is not a dry heat like where I grew up - it has a bit of humidity and if you are not too far from the coast then you get a good breeze too. The property market in Sydney has cooled - just ask me! We have two investment properties we would like to off load but we would have to give them away at the moment. The interest rates have been increasing lately and that has had a downward effect on house buying prices and an upward impact on rental. We bought a house just over a year ago - big on a big block, needing some updating and I think it was quite reasonably priced. Brisbane is more affordable, but the weather can be very humid (my DS1 gets eczema flare ups terribly when we go up there). In Perth the accommodation is in short supply and this has driven the prices up - but then wages there are pretty high too.

Significantly, food is cheaper, fresher and better quality and that goes for the supermarket as well as eating out!

Melbourne weather can be four seasons in one day and they don't have proper beaches. Adelaide is famous for its shark population and is not a very 'sophisticated' city.

From a tax/money perspecitive the best thing to do if you are in your 20's and 30's with qualifications is to come out on a 457 Long term business visa sponsored by an employer and get heaps of tax deductions - like rent. It is called 'living away from home' tax status and these days you can stay on it indefinitely.

I would keep your property in the UK and rent it out and come out here and try it out and get a feel for the city and what suits you before buying property here.

From my impressions of the UK health system from several years on MN I can tell you that Australia is way way better, but by no means perfect. What I have noticed is that in Australia I can get a referral to a specialist any time I like. It makes sense to be in a Private Health Fund IMO if you have kids. We pay $202 per month and that covers ancillary and hospitals, though there is a gap, you can get more back in your tax return and there are tax incentives to be covered by Private Health Insurance.

Our schools public and private are good, as measured by international studies by the OECD e.g., PISA. The public school system origins are definitely english - so you probably wouldn't find it too foreign. If you live in a 'good' suburb the local public school will generally be 'good'.

As the weather is good and the kids are outside being active there is less need to scream and yell at bored kids inside or to have them babysat by the tv or computer.

While crime etc sells papers a look at the cold hard stats would reveal that Australia is a 'safer' country to bring your kids up in.

I hope none of that is too controversial or biased and is of some help.

[mymama]

What is the weather like across the county?

I am in Brisbane and it can get quite warm during Summer. So very hot for 2 to 3 months of year and perfect for other 9 to 10 months of the year. Funny enough I have just spent 3 months in England and had about 3 weeks max of rain. On return to Brisbane on 1st Jan we have had 4 days of sunshine. Not usual though.

We have aircondioning throughout and an plunge pool in the back yard. tbh only have aircon on a few times in the Summer.

All shops, cinemas, restaurants and such are airconditioned. Most schools aren't though . Our school summer hols are mid Dec to end Jan so only a few weeks of heat for them anyway.

Which places get too hot and which are more like the UK?

Darwin and Cairns would be very hot.

Think you will find most places quite warm until you climatise. Best option would be to arrive March to June so you will have lovely temps for a good six months to adjust. Melbourne and anywhere in Tasmania you will most likeley find "UK" weather. Not as extreme though.

What is the politics like and actual living in Aus? eg. healthcare system, taxes, utilites etc.? Is it always a case of 'the grass is greener' or would living in Aus really be 'nicer' than living in the UK?

Having met and spoken to a lot of families in the UK I think we win hands down. You have the NHS which is free whereas we pay for dentists and doctors. Only kids are usually bulk billed (paid for my Medicare). A standard gp consult would be around $50 = 20 pound and you get half back from medicare if eligible. Public hospitals are free but waiting lists can be long for some things. I pay $160 month for private health = top hospital cover and all of the extras such as dentists, opticians etc.

Not sure about people coming over. Us sahm's are "paid" to stay home with our dc. Depending on what your dh would earn and number of dc you can get up to $500 a fortnight. Couples having a baby get a lump sum of $5000 when the child is born regardless of income.

What is the schooling like? We have 2dc's, our eldest only just started school this year. We would have to move from where we are in the UK anyway for a decent secondary school (our catchment primary school is very good though) so thought if emmigration was a possibility it would be atleast 2-4 years away.

Schools are generally good. You have very good ones and then average ones. I don't think there are any "bad" schools. In Qld you can pretty much choose any school you want your children to go to where you live. You do have to pay for school books and supplies here. My dc's books were around $300 for 2 dc this year. Am in the process of "covering" them with sticky contact. Remember a UK mum her who was shocked at the whole idea of buying books and then covering them as well. lol

What are the house prices like? Is Aus having a housing market boom like we are? Have we missed the boat or are house prices still 'good' over there compared to in the UK?

In my neighbourhood (35 mins from Brisbane CBD) a brand new 4 bed, 2 bath, 3 living room house on 800 sqm will cost you $440,000 to $500,000 (less than 200,000 pounds). Council rates (tax) are approx $1800 a year.

Renting a house same as above would be around $350 a week.

I guess you have to see for yourself. We have a large number of expats in our area who love it. I have become quite close with an english lady and an irish lady in particular. They desperately miss their families but claim that the lifestyle for their dc outweighs that. Their dc do outdoor sport and activities all year round after school. You can swim for 9 months of the year.

I also have a lovely english friend who came over in 2004 with her dh and dd. She hated it. She stayed two years and went back with her dd. Her dh stayed here . She is english through and through and could not adjust. She missed her family too much. I visited her when I was in the UK in December and she is much happier back where she belongs.

[mymama]

thequeenofcontradiction - I have to disagree about the tv being awful. After spending 3 months in UK I could not wait to get back to decent telly. I am talking about free to air versus free to air not cable. I think I saw my life's fill of property shows in the UK. Couldn't stand the british "dramas" but must admit I am hooked on eastenders enough to have me searching foxtel to see which package I need to watch it.

[99redballoons]

Hi all, thanks so much for the new replies. Sorry for not coming back sooner, we've all had bad colds atm and no time for the pc!

It really does sound lovely and I think everyone's suggestion of coming over for a few weeks is such good sense. We were saving to go skiing next season, but I think Aus will have to come before that! Ds is in reception atm and doing well so hopefully taking him out won't be an issue.

What would be a sensible 3 wk trip? I guess it would be too much to go to Perth, Sydney and Townsville in one go? (we have friends in Perth, family in Townsville, and would love to check out Sydney!!!)

[mymama]

The jet lag will kick in big time. I have just flown back from London and was shocked at how long it took to recover. Going over to London wasn't bad at all.

Perhaps you could fly into Sydney or Perth and spend time there then fly onto the other destinations. Keep in mind it is a 5 to 6 hour flight from Sydney to Perth. Australia really is huge.

I would be suprised if you could fly direct from Townsville to Perth. You would most likely have to go via Brisbane or Sydney. A flight from Brisbane to Townsville is 2 hours and 3 hours for Sydney to Townsville.

[chloeb2002]

you could check out virgin blue flights or jet star for cheap internal flights between cities and you could say fly into sydney and out of perth? you could do a week in each. Just out of interest what jobs would you be coming to do? just heading somewhere like townsville may seem like a good idea but if you are wreckying to move then check it is suitable. the right work etc. otherwise brisbane maybe a better bet for work and a visit, not as hot as townsville either!

[99redballoons]

Thanks for the flying info.

Hi chloeb2002, would just visit my family in Townsville, wasnt' thinking of it as somewhere to settle. My cousins have told us how hot it is. We'd be going on my dh's work(IT), even though I have a degree etc I haven't worked for 4 yrs as now a sahm.

It's hard doing this research without talking to the 'close' people we know that know loads about Aus. I have a 2 cousins that grew up in Townsville (now in the UK!) and my bil is from nr Sydney. Just can't talk to them yet about 'moving' only 'holidaying'. I also have another UK cousin that's been travelling out there for almost 2 years now and loves it. Feel an email coming on to them all!

[99redballoons]

What is a good month to visit? Prices seem to have dropped by March? What is the weather like then? and also in May?

[bobsmum]

99 - wow! Just saw this! I thought it was Bournemouth - this is a bit further

[99redballoons]

Hi bobsmum well... we thought if we're gonna move we might as well do it in style!

You know what, I love the UK loads, but the weather is just getting me down. Dh actually suggested it and my sis will be moving out there at some point as her dh is from Aus. Just looking into it atm.

[bobsmum]

I've been getting to know a girl in my playgroup who lived in Aus for 5 years and has just moved back for various reasons. She's got some very funny stories about Australian citizenship ceremonies. Apparenlty you need to wear a special hat?!

[mymama]

March is start of autumn hence the drop in prices. March to May would be lovely weather. I got married in May for the weather .

bobsmum - no idea what you are talking about re special hats. Have seen quite a few citizenship ceremonies but haven't seen hats. Some lovely UK friends have just been accepted as Australian citizens and will have their ceremony on 28th Feb so will be checking out the hats now.

[sunnydelight]

I feel so sorry for the tourists here in Sydney at the moment. They have paid top dollar to come in Summer and it's pissing down! It really isn't a good Summer here at all.

In terms of places to live, I would heartily recomment Sydney if you can afford it! We sold a house in SE England but have decided to keep renting here for a while as we can't really afford to buy what we want. Our rent is $900 a week - a mortgage would be much higher - but to put it in perspective we have a big, 4 bed house with a pool in a desirable area so you can't moan too much. IT salaries are lower here though (compared to London). DH took a 1/3 pay cut which obviously isn't great, but we know people who worked in IT outside London who matched their salaries here.

People are SO friendly here as someone else said - it's a real pleasure just doing day to day business. It also feels really safe and there are lots of opportunities for the kids to spend time outdoors. DS1 has discovered the joys of surfing and there are lots of great playgrounds around (all with clean toilets and (mostly) free barbies). Sydney festival is on at the moment so there is lots happening - unfortunately stuff like free outdoor cinema isn't great in the rain

Transport is dirt cheap compared to London, but everyone moans about the train service. Not sure why myself - DH uses it most days for work and finds it fine, if busy. People love their cars here and traffic can be a nightmare, but lots of people do drive to work. It would be important to know where your DH would be working before deciding where to live.

DH and I meet in Sydney many years ago and welived here together for a year before heading to the UK, but we still did a reccie in 2006 before deciding to make the move. With three kids - then aged 3, 8 and 13 - we needed to be sure it wasn't just a great romantic notion. I must admit I have no regrets about moving - but I'm not English anyway so the UK was never "home" which does make things easier. Good luck whatever you decide.

[eidsvold]

bobsmum - must depend on where you are - when dh had his ceremony - no silly hat BUT a free aussie native tree to plant.