Should we move to Oz?

[nat24]

hi all ive got a little dilema and hope you can help.

My DP is a Plumbing and Heating Engineer and wants to emigrate to Oz at the end of the year. He's all for it and has been looking at Perth, Adelaide, Brisbain and Melbourne. He's on the net every night researching. The thing is im not too sure if i want to go. I just dont want to be that far away from my family. I currently live about 100 miles away from them which is about 1 and a half hours but i dont think i can handle being thousands of miles away. A friend of mine has just moved over to Perth and shes trying to convince me to move too. I just dont know what to do. DP and i will be ttc conceive our 1st baby next month and once the baby's here ill need my mum even more.

Has anyone else been in a similar situation?

How did you decide what to do?

and

Have you ever regreted it?

I know i have to make a decision quick due to visas etc but its just so hard.

Please help!!

[NappiesGalore]

i reckon you can get a quality of life over there that would be much more difficult to achieve here; nicer house/area, better weather, more healthy, outdoor lifestyle, etc etc.
but
if you miss your family now, you will even more there. it doesnt sound like you want to go at all and until you do, you are bound to 'fail' at being happy there.

why not take the pressure off a little and ask dp if you can go for a holiday and have a see how you feel when youre there?
personally, i fell in love with the place and if i was struggling financially here, id move over there almost definately...

[nat24]

I did mention going on holiday there 1st and DP agreed that it would be a good idea (theres no point in moving over if we dont like it).I agree about the better quality of life etc and i know that Oz would be a better place to bring children up. I spoke to my parents about it at the weekend my mum doesnt want me to go at all. She already really misses me not living with her and not seeing me as much. I think this is one of the main things putting me off. My dad just told me to go. He said theres nothing left in this country and there will definatly be nothing for my children. He even promised to come over and see me every 6 months. Its a big decision and i want to make sure i make the right one.

[01kiwicath]

Hi there Nat...
I hear your pain! I am currently living here for a few years and have just had a visit from my family who I am very close with, it had been 5mths since I'd seen them but now that we have a child it makes a huge diiference in terms of all the stuff they don't get to be part of with her.
Even though I know we're not going to be here forever, I still miss them terribly and if you miss yours now, I know you will probably not enjoy it as much as you should.
Of course as mentioned its wonderful to bring up a family and theres loads of great reasons to go but you also have a family here that as great as it would be to visit a few times a year, its not quite the smae when you just want to go and spend teh weekend or have some alone time together with hubby and let the wee ones stay with your parents etc.

This is a huge move and I know exactly how you must be feeling....definetly go for a holiday and then try to imagine you wouldn't see your parents for maybe 6x as long as the time away!!!! It would be so hard for me, it is at the moment and I know I'm going back! Good luck

[mummydoc]

Hi , i lived there for nearly 7 years and had dd1 over there, we originally went for a year and were having such a greta time we stayed and stayed, it broke my mother's heart tbh and then ewhen i had dd1 things definitely changed. i will agree to a part the standard of living is better BUT you still haev to go towork, you still have to pay th ebills/ do the supermarket shop/ organise childcare etc etc, so in reality the stresses of modern life are the same the sun just shines more. where we lived it was exceedingly hot 4 months of the yr and so you couldn't take LOs to the park etc , i missed my parents so much we eventually moved back and though we miss are aussie friends i have never doubted we made the right descision. the bond my dd2 ( born here) has with her grandparents is fantastic and we have lots of family support /help. we all have dual nationality so may go back some day or my girls can go later on but i don't miss it at all. though i do live in a gorgeous part of uk in and my dds have an idyllic country childhood - so maybe colours my judgement and granny is round the corner... if you are not sure don't go...

[Flumpytina]

Hi, as the other posters have said I would definately go for a holiday (extended if possible) to see if you like the place. I lived in Oz for two and a half years (I have dual citizenship hence the long stay), and although I loved every minute of it I definately never felt an urge to stay there permanantly.

Obviously the weather is much better (especially if you move to Brisbane), and there is more space, and the beaches and outdoor lifestyle are fab. But there are 'quality of life issues' over there, just as there are here. Life and all it's baggage will go with you...and you won't have your family relatively nearby to help.

It's a really hard decision for you, personally I just could not have been that far away from my family permanently, and funnily while I was over there I realised all the things I really loved about England and being British and by the end couldn't wait to get back to the grey drizzly days!!! (very odd I know...but its home here).

Not sure if that will have been any help at all, Oz is an amazing place, but it certainly isn't the utopia that some people who emigrate think it will be before they get there.

[nat24]

Thanks for all the replies. You are all right. I must go on holiday there 1st before making my final decision. I might not even like the place or on the other hand i might fall in love with it. Even if i do decide to go i can always come back. And that way my DP will know that i tried.

Does anyone have any suggestions on the best areas to bring up children. We've looked at Melbourne, Perth (my friend lives there), Adelaide and Brisbaine.

Is the cost of living similar to here?

Nat x

[Flumpytina]

Well they're all big cities so the lifestyle is very much the same as being in a cosmopolitan city over here. Nice parts, horrid parts.

In terms of weather you will get 4 seasons in Adelaide and Melbourne, whereas Brisbane being so much further north tends to have warmer weather for most of the year (but not the extremes of the wet/dry heat you get at the top end).

IMO if I had to move to the 4 you listed then I would pick Adelaide...it's the most 'English' of the four with a lovely city centre and great access to some fantastic wine growing areas (lovely beaches too).

Not sure about the cost of living Q as I left in 2000, I imagine buying property in the good areas of any of the cities will be pricey. Food is cheap though...especially meat..Oh the steak over there (hmmmmm fond memories of nightly barbies)!!!

Why not Sydney (just interested)??

[nat24]

Sydney was one of the places that i was looking at but have since been told thay living in Sydney is very expensive. Dont know how true that is but it kind of put me off. If it isnt true then Sydney would def be top of the list.

Theres something else i need to ask. Its about spiders. I have a huge spider phobia even a picture of one has me crying and uncontrolably shaking. Is there lots of spiders over in Oz. My friend that lives in Perth has been there since Nov and she said that its no different that here. I always thought that they have the huge ones over there though. DPs aunt lives in Alice Springs. She said she has huge ones walking around her house. There is no way what so ever that i would be able to cope with that.

[Flumpytina]

erm, well yes there are spiders (sorry). I guess I saw no more spiders in Oz than I do in England...however the ones I did see did tend to be a larger and hairier variety than your common 'in the bath' British ones. (that's not very reassuring...I'm sorry).

Sydney is expensive, especially if you want to live anywhere near the water...it is however an amazing city...you should check it out before you cross it off your list.

[nat24]

Do you know of any websites that i can look up Sydney on.

Did you stay in Sydney? Were the spiders huge? I dont mind the little ones, there ok. But the thought of huge ones walking around my house gives me shivers up my spine. Especially fury ones. I think my friend was lying to me. She said she hasnt seen any. She'd say anything to get me over there though!!

[eidsvold]

I can appreciate where you are coming from. I moved to the UK to live and work. Ended up meeting my dh and having dd1 whilst there. I never intended to stay forever and dh was keen to emigrate too.

It was very hard when I had my first daughter - I had no family support, my fabulous MIL was coping with caring for her very ill mother and so was unable to support us as much as she would have liked. Our dd1 was born with a heart defect that required two open heart surgeries at 8 weeks old. SHe also has special needs - very tough on a new mum.

When we moved to Aus I was 20 weeks pregnant with dd2. We have been here 2 1/2 years and don't regret moving back. Luckily we are near my family but again - my um works full time and so in terms of helping out when dd2 was born - I did not have the help that others have.

My MIL has never met dd2. We took her only grandchildren and moved to the other side of the world. Whilst she misses us dreadfully - she accepts that we have such a quality of life that we would never have been able to have in the UK. I am able to be a SAHM. We live in a nice area, we are able to take holidays etc without breaking the bank.

We had a tought ime last year - my lovely FIL was diagnosed with a very aggressive terminal cancer and died soon after - making it very tough for dh. He did manage to go over nad have some time with his dad and he got back over the the UK for the funeral... it is times like that you are aware of the distance.

However - we can see how our children have blossomed and especially for our eldest we did the best thing for our family.

As to where to live - we are in BRisbane and it is very warm at the moment - lots of homes are now air conditioned so that helps. Probably really hot for Jan/Feb and that is about it. Rest of the time it is lovely. As to cost of living - Sydney and Melbourne used to be very expensive. THey have now released a study saying things like real estate are more expensive in Perth and that Melbourne is now one of the more affordable places to live. In terms of day to day expenses - Brisbane and Adelaide tend to be cheaper.

TBH if you are sure you don't want to do it then I really don't think you will be happy here. If you need to be very close to your family and find it very hard being 100 miles away from them then being on the other side of the world is going to be much much harder.

I agree coming for a holiday is a start but still not a true indication of the life you would have here.

It is tough moving away from family and friends and those I have seen who have returned are those who weren't really sure in the first place and probably in their heart of hearts did not want to come but did so reluctantly.

[humpydumpy]

Hi nat24. I am over here in Perth and been here for a year. We moved here as an opportunity came our way which was way too good to turn down, so never really had the the dilemma over where to go and do I want to do it. It was more a case of we would be mad not to give it a go. DH is from Perth so we have all his family and friends here for support which has really helped me settle.

I think you really need to do some research into the different areas and then maybe plan a holiday to get a feel for the area. You will never get an accurate idea of what it is like to live there but you can look at things like, would you be comfortable driving around there (eg. I could never drive in Sydney but little ole Perth is fine).

Being away from family is hard especially when you have kids. All the mums I know joined a postnatal group when they had their 1st child and are still meeting up with the mums they met there, so that is a great way of meeting other people for support.

Emmigrating is not something I would rush into. You need to really want to do it and 100 per cent want to make the most of it.

Of my experience here, I love it. I came out here with the understanding with DH that if I hadn't settled in 2-3 years, we would come back. After 1 year here I don't think I will be using that option.

[sunnydelight]

We're off to Sydney, hopefully in April, and yes - it is an expensive option compared to other parts of Oz but DH and I lived there many years ago (we met there), and that's where it will be easiest for DH to get the best job (he's in IT). We did toy briefly with other areas and when I see the prices of houses on programmes like "Wanted Down Under" in Adelaide and Brisbane I think maybe we're mad, but I absolutely love Sydney. We took the three kids for a holiday in November just to make sure we weren't remembering things with rose tinted glasses, and they loved it, as did we. The big thing for me though is the fact that I do not have close family in the UK - my mum is dead, my dad and sister and her family are in Ireland and my sister will visit as she and her family all have Australian citizenship from years back. DH isn't close to his mum, his dad is dead, and if I never saw MIL again in my life it wouldn't bother me. In your situation I'm not sure if I would be able to do it; having lost my mum I know that if she was still alive (even though we weren't in the same country I saw her 3/4 times a year) I probably couldn't make the move. I think you really need to take as long a holiday as you can afford there to at least know what you're considering, but it's hard to get over the missing family thing. My sister ultimately went back to Ireland after 6 wonderful years in Sydney as by then she had two kids and wanted to be near her mum!

[nat24]

DP and i have had a very long discussion this evening. Ive told him exactly how i feel and he was actualy really nice about it. He feels the same in regards to missing family but wants to make a better life for us and our future children. Now that ive spoken to him i do feel a little better about it all. At 1st i felt like i was being pushed into a corner but now ive had time to think, im more positive.

Weve agreed to firstly go over for a long holiday to see what we think. Then if we do move over but cant settle (hopefully we will)within 18months - 2 yrs, then we will come back.

I can definatly see the benefits of emigrating. Everyday i wake up and hate living in this country. The goverment has turned it in to a sham.

Id love to wake up everyday in the sun, spend the day at the beach and even have xmas dinner on the beach.

I know that moving to OZ would mean a better quality of life i.ts just the family thing that gets to me

So first thingd first. Were hoping to visit my friend in Perth in a couple of months to see what we think and then take it from there.

Thanks for all the advice guys. Its nice to talk to people who understand where im coming from

[humpydumpy]

Hi Nat24. I'm glad you feel better about things, it did sound a bit like you were being forced into something you didn't really want. It really important you keep talking with dp and family about what you want and don't get rushed into something you don't want. If I could change anything about my move, it would be that I was more vocal about what I wanted. I found that I just let myself be swept along with dh excitement and his plans and in the end (even though I wanted the move) it was all alittle too quick for me.

I would also say it is a very good idea to go and stay with your friends. I found that by staying with friends and family on our previous visits, I had a more realistic idea of the lifestyle here. Although I am sure they will put on a good show to convince you to stay.

[eidsvold]

i think you need to give yourself a good couple of years here before deciding to return ( if that is the case) I know it probably took me 2 - 3 years to really settle in the UK... although I only ended up staying 4!!

[eidsvold]

i think staying with friends is a good idea - tbh the day to day things - work, sleep, eat etc are not that different but the overall lifestyle is - sounds strange but true.

[scully]

Hi Nat24, I've just returned after 11yrs in the UK so understand what you are thinking about, wtih the countries reversed
Having children and not being near your family is tough, not impossible to do, but tough. We had dd1 and dd2 in the UK, and there was just us and a good support network of friends, but no family to fall back on, ever. To be honest, one of the main reasons we returned was so the dd's could develop a relationship with family here, get to know their 1 grandparent who is still alive, their aunts, uncles and cousins, and so we timed our move around dd1 starting school here, rather than in the UK.
I would definitely come out here for a holiday, and then perhaps another holiday when you need to activate your visas, and then after 2 trips here, make the decision pack up and move, if you feel it's right. There are a lot of opportunities here and things do feel a lot more positive generally here than in the UK, but moving countries is a lot more difficult than anyone ever envisages. I agree with Eidsvold, can take a lot longer than you first thought, settling somewhere new. Make sure you quiz your friends loads about the positives and negatives they've found since moving out here. Good luck

[Paranoid1stTimer]

Bit of a late reply here, but DH and I lived in Melbourne renting a 1 bed apartment for 4 months a couple of years ago. The cost of living and house prices aren't really that much cheaper than the UK and eating out, food etc prices aren't much cheaper either.

Public transport was better and slightly more affordable/reliable. Driving over in Melbourne is crazy and there seems to be a drink drive culture that you don't (or didn't until more recently) have in the UK. There seem to be a lot more car accidents but I am not sure if that is statistical and due to the larger population over there. I dunno.

Although house prices etc are not that much cheaper, the food like fresh fruit and veg are much bigger and better than the cr@p we get here. The weather is a definite bonus as you are not stuck in the house - which is also good cos you can't really be a couch potato since the tv is shocking. Honestly, when we were there Lost had just started and it was titles, adverts for 10 mins, 10 mins of Lost, same 10 mins of adverts again, 10 mins of Lost etc etc... You forget you are watching something cos you channel hop during the adverts. Then after the last set of adverts you get the end titles of the show you were watching having say through 10 mins of those blimmin adverts again!!! ARGH!!!

Anyway, we loved Melbourne so much we are currently in the process of applying for a visa but I would say Australia is - and really feels like - the other side of the world. You only have a couple of hours window to phone home cos when Oz is awake UK is asleep and if anything good/bad happens you are at least 24 hrs away.

I really felt far from home and isolated sometimes. Also, you can't get a real idea of the immense size of the continent - it really is H-U-G-E!!! We thought we would travel around a lot more but internal flights are quite expensive and train travel from Melbourne to Sydney was going to take somthing like 16 hrs!!!

Anway, best of luck and definitely rent somewhere until you find a suburb/type of house you would really like to live in.

[newgirl]

why not move to cornwall instead?! there are nice beaches/schools/vegetables there!

it depends on how close you are to your family - having grandparents (as long as they are nice) is a wonderful thing and an important part of a child's life - by moving that far away you may only see them once or twice a year. I think that is huge shame.

[elvisgirl]

We live in Sydney & find a lot of things more expensive than the UK but of course some are cheaper (petrol!!). I think we notice it more cos everyone says Oz is so much cheaper so you get preconceived ideas. However, we can just about survive with me not working as my partner has a professional grade job & we don't live in a one of the more popular suburbs.
Sydney city is excellent but I find it's only the centre - as soon as you get into the suburbs it's pretty dull. This is painful for me but it depends on the individual.
I too am utterly petrified of spiders so probably not a good idea for us to have moved into a house that backs onto bush! In a few months we have had one big one outside so far. You can get your house professionally sprayed to deter them & other insects once or twice a year, then top up in between with sprays you can buy if you don't mind the chemicals & make sure to brush away cobwebs that build up around the outside of the house. Also make sure you have insect screens & don't have windows open without the screens. I would love to have fresh air in the house but just rack up the air conditioning instead.

[ninedragons]

Just a cautionary tale: I've done things the other way - I am from Australia but have been floating round the world for over a decade now. I've lived in the UK, Hong Kong and now Shanghai, but I had a baby last week and I am suddenly ferociously homesick, to the point that hearing Ricky Ponting (or anyone with an Australian accent) interviewed on the BBC can almost make me cry.

I think we probably still have a year or two to go in Asia, but it can't go quickly enough for me.

It was pretty obviously the baby that kicked it all off for me, so your plan of an extended visit and settling-in period is a good one.

I haven't spent all that much time in Perth but now I think about it, the spiders are big but not as bad as they are in Sydney. You will definitely have to acclimatise yourself to seeing them, though.

Personally I would make sure that you are going to salaries that are not only enough to live on, but enough to fly home twice a year. I watch "Wanted Down Under" and think hmm, those people going out as teachers are all thinking "yippee! cheap petrol", but flying a family of five back to the UK is prohibitively expensive on a gross salary of 23,000 pounds.

[sandcastles]

If you come on holiday, you need to look into things as much as possible.

Wages, flights, taxes, property prices, car prices etc. Don't get tempted & convert them to UK pounds, as it will seem cheap/er. Find out what you/dp would be earning & base the costs on that.

Don't just come for the scenery & decide you can do it. The reality of living here is different.

Dh has family here, he lived here from 3 - 21. We had dd in 2003 & came for a visit 2005, he decided then that he wanted to come here & live again as he missed family & wanted dd to have a better life. We have been here since Jun 06 & he is unhappy, wanting to return to the UK. He can't pinpoint why, just that things were not as he expected, although he has enjoyed being with his family.

We are in Adelaide & although others have said that we get seasons, we don't as such. They all seem to merge together. It is also said that it is quite an English place, but I don't see that. It is Australia! The outdoor lifestyle I do love, but you have to like heat. We have had lots of 38+ days here this summer & generally confined to the house on the hotter days. Which is really like the UK, just the reverse form the rain.

Since we have been here I have watched property prices rise from around $180k to $250k for a 3 bed. That, convereted to pounds sounds good, but it depends on your salary here etc. We looked into buying & our monthly payment was excessive, it seemed that over 20 odd years we would be paying back alot more than we borrowed.

Yes, petrol is cheaper, but other things aren't. Dh got his first car insurance breakdown a few months ago & he had to pay GST [like VAT] and stamp duty [on car insurance]. He also paid GST & stamp duty when he brought it. So although it was cheaper, he paid 2 taxes at the time. Car tax isn't cheap either. And works out more a year here than in the UK.

I love it here, but will return with dh if he is really still unhappy.

[ghosty]

When we moved to NZ in 2002 we just did it. I had spent a week in Auckland staying with my terrible awful inlaws and still thought, "Oh, what the hell, what have we got to lose?" and two months later left my very much loved family to bring DS to NZ.
DH and I knew that to get ANY kind of quality of life as a family we HAD to leave the UK. We were prepared to give it a go and thought we could always go back if it didn't work out. But we saw the move as permanent. I think if you give yourself a time limit ("I'll give it 18 months - 2 years") I'll bet anything you will move back. 2 years is not a long time and goes very quickly. It isn't until you have known people for at least 2 years that you begin to feel you have 'history' with them ...
Ha, and then after 5 years in NZ we decided to up sticks and come to Melbourne [nutters] so I am back in the 'getting to know people and the place' zone again (been here for 9 months) and although this time we have kept our NZ house we see it as a 'permanent' move with no time limit.
It is hard without family (I don't have a decent alternative with DH's family sadly as they are all Loons ) but I will always be grateful that my parents encouraged us to go. My mother, in fact, ordered me to go [bless her]. She said that I would be totally MAD to stay in England just for them - she pointed out that she and my Dad wouldn't be around for ever and then where would we be?
My parents have been to see us twice and we have been back twice in 6 years. My sister visited once. I think my children have actually had more quality time with my parents since we left as when we are together it is for an intensive minimum of 3 weeks (rather than the odd afternoon or night or weekend here and there).
The difficult time for me is yet to come - my father is not well and I know that in the coming years we are going to have to do something about trips back. I don't know how often he will be able to come here anymore and financially it is a huge stretch to go back once a year. But we are going to take each year as they come. My dad has categorically told me NOT to come rushing home just for him. He says that my children and husband come first. I agree to a point but that didn't stop me booking flights for June anyway
The cost of trips back is phenomenal - $6100 for me and the children (DH is staying in Melbourne)
The cost of living in Melbourne is generally high but it depends on where you live and work and how much you earn. To live in the salubrious inner suburbs you need $1.5M+ to buy a really nice home (that you can write home about to boast about you wonderful lifestyle). But if you don't mind living further out then you can get great houses with all the extras for much less of course.
Australian TV is pants (IMO) and if you love your Tesco's and Asdas you may be in for quite a shock - what I love about Melbourne are the food markets and small old fashioned butcher and green grocer shops - I never buy fresh produce from supermarkets ...
I think it gets too hot in Melbourne (some days of 40+) but it is never for longer than 4 days in a row - the heat breaks after a few days and goes back down to a nice doable 29/30 (like today )
Spiders. Yes. I hate the feckers too. I am the typical arachnaphobe ... I have been known to pass out on coming face to face with an 8 legged monster (in ENGLAND )
In 9 months I have seen 2 big spiders in our house. Both huntsman spiders. Big hairy ugly buggers but apparently harmless . There may have been more but if DH sees them first he gets rid before I see them (he is my Spider Knight). I spray the house regularly and keep it very clean - no dusty cobwebby corners allowed!
At this stage I won't commit to going to Queensland (sorry Eidsvold) I am too scared

[dejags]

Oh I too have my tales of moving around the world.

DH and I met in South Africa - we moved to the UK in 1992 (well I moved back - I am English). We live in the UK until 2004 until we decided that we needed a better quality of life for all - for us this primarily meant a move away from a cold weather climate. So we opted to move back to South Africa - warm weather, improving economy and hopefully a good life for the kids.

Sadly, we very soon realised after landing that it wasn't going to work. It's a fabulous place for a holiday but the crime and other issues put us right off. So we made a decision to apply for a visa for Aus and planned a trip out there.

We spent three months in Aus/NZ in 2006 as part of a round the world trip with the boys. Towards the end of the trip - I unexpectedly fell pregnant with DD so we had to delay our plans. We are still in South Africa but have now finalised our leaving date in June of this year - we are going to Brisbane.

We loved the time we spent there. Warm weather, good schools, lovely beaches and big enough to offer good job prospects for DH.

The one thing I have learned to accept is that nowhere is perfect. The things I love most about the UK are impossible to find in SA and no doubt, the things I love most about SA will be difficult to find in Oz.