Born Spongers

[TwoIfBySea]

I was told about this story by DH who saw it in the paper at his work. This is typical of some of the families around here - living off benefits without shame.

Read it here

One of my neighbours and friends is on disability and is worried sick that she is seen as a sponger. Why should she worry when people like this seem to have no intention of working when there is no reason that they shouldn't be.

DH is not in the best paid job but we get by but it shouldn't be that those who don't work get more than those who are trying their best.

Maybe I am being to harsh but it does make me so angry.

[tangerinecath]

Two If By Sea, I've just been watching about this family on ITV. Couldn't agree more. There's another thread here

[Aero]

Isn't this on TV now? ITV.

[TwoIfBySea]

What future for any child born into a family like that?

I didn't watch the programme on purpose, I feel that perhaps these girls should be reminded that unprotected sex can give you more than a baby.

DH and I were talking about a nearby family where the parents don't work but they have tons of money. We just couldn't live like that, it wouldn't feel right, we wouldn't have earned it IYSWIM. Not only that DH said he would be ashamed if his boys grew up thinking all daddy did was sit on his behind (be it at home, in a pub or at the bookies.) It is obvious from the baby-mothers that their attitude is one of, the world owes them a living.

[mieow]

I feel the same at the mo, twoifbysea. Dh has worked since he was 15, I worked from 16-19 when I fell pregnant with DS, at 20 I went back to work in the evenings, but a year later I had to leave when DS was diagnosed with Cerebral Palsy. I had DD1 6 months later, she was diagnosed with CP a year after her birth. Then 4 months later I had DD2. DH was working nights to bring in £230 a week. I had to deal with two disabled kids and a baby.
Last year DH seriously hurt his knee and is unable to work at present. I have thought about going back to work myself but DH couldn't do all the school runs (the kids are at 3 different schools) and the appointments.
We are hoping he will be back to work soon, as I hate people thinking we are spongers, when for 8 years we supported ourselves.

[JoolsToo]

these are the ones on Young Parent thingy which is why i didn't watch!

[mieow]

yes the family are the same ones that were just on the ITV1

[nikkim]

the thing you have to ask is would you want their life, even if it meant a little more cash coming in every week. I know the estate the family live on and I know I wouldn't want to live on there unless I really had to. There life may look easy but look at the state of their house and there is no chance of bettering themselves, they live where the council has put them rather than having the luxury of choice. Their kids will go to the dire school which serves the estate so there life chances are diminished by that factor alone. They may get housing benefit but I personally would rather pay out for my mortgage secure in the knowldege that my house is my own and that as prices will rise I will have an investment as well as a roof over my head. As for the young mums foolish and selfish as they may be I do feel sorry for a young girl who sees her future in making babies before she has become an adult herself.

I also think we are in danger of judging people who claim sickness benefit for mental health reasons as fraudulant. I have clamied DLA after having serious depression and at times I felt like a fraud but I know that if I had rushed back to work I risked another breakdown and my daughter may have ended up in care, caliming benefits allowed me time to put my life back together and focus on being a well mother rather than rushing back into the rat race.

[soapbox]

Nikkim, I think this whole area is quite controversial! However, I think that the fact that these people can CHOOSE to live like this is part of the problem. If they grow up in a culture where being subsidised by others is the norm then there is no self-motivation for them to break out of the circle.

I'm afraid the only way I can think of breaking the whole dependancy cycle is to remove the choice not to work from those that are able to.

This by no means should extend to anyone who is incapable of working be that through physical or mental illness. That is what the welfare state at its most basic is there to provide for and should protect those who are vulnerable and sick. IMO it is not there to subsidise folk who just can't be bothered working.

And before anyone asks, I do consider looking after one's own children to be working, but don't think it needs two parents to look after them!

[mieow]

so you don't think it needs two parents to look after two disabled kids and one NT kid? Sorry if you didn't read my message, but I did look after my three while DH worked till last year.

[mieow]

and as the kids have got older the disabilities are taking a toll, especially on DS, he can't walk as walk far as he previously could, I'm lucky if he can manage 10 minutes now. I want Dh to go back to work, as does he, but at present he isn't allowed to work, and as I am the Brains of the relationship re, appointments, eductaion things, etc etc I can't work as it takes all my time up

[soapbox]

Mieow - that wasn't directed at you at all - I've said I am very supportive of people who need help getting it - and I would most definately put you and your DH into that category. You are not CHOOSING not to work you are not able to work. Of course that is reasonable that's what the welfare state is there for!

I was referring to the famililies where neither parent chooses to work. What I was saying that I would be happy to see money going to support single mums but in a two parent household (excluding where one parent can't work) then its reasonable to expect one of the parents to work when the other one looks after the children!

[mieow]

Ok Soapbox, no hard feelings I hate feeling like a sponger, and hated going to The DSS when DH was first off sick, we had supported ourselves for so long. My old neighbour was the same, having kids with different men, claiming benifit while her bf was working and living there....
grrrrr

[soapbox]

Mieuw - things must be hard enough for you as it is with out thinking people are taking pot shots at you

This whole subject is a minefield to discuss rationally. But it seems to me that if we have an ever aging population which needs supporting and a growing number of people who don't work because they don't fancy it - then in time there won't be enough money to go around. IMO it is people who really need the money who should be first in the queue - the old, and those who can't work because they are sick or disabled and those working at bringing up the next generation.

[mieow]

I know, I can't work out why people say they would be worse off working, even after we had paid our rent and CT we were £100 a week better off when DH was working than we are now. I think they can't be bothered. The news acticle said that the family would have to earn £30,000 to make it worthwhile, if the parents both worked and those girls hadn't got pregnant they could be clearing £40,000 (on a average £10,000 each)

[TwoIfBySea]

Mieouw sorry if you felt you were being gotten at. I think the line blurs and people like yourself get upset when what is really annoying people are those, like the ones in the paper, who are quite happy to live off the state when there is nothing preventing them from working. It is people like that who are actually taking the money that should go to those who really do need it.

I have a neighbour (who has twins also but I don't really get on with her as she is quite an aggressive person) who told me her and her DH get £340 per week. Apart from her utility bills that is hers to spend. Both are not working and not only that her mother turns up every day to look after the twins so they can go out.

True, I wouldn't swap my life for the extra cash they get as that wouldn't sit comfortably with me. Although I am a SAHM just now I worked from 16 and will work again in the future. There is just a great sense of injustice that people who deserve it never get it and those who don't always seem to know the tricks to getting it all.

[mieow]

Twoifbysea, I know what you are saying, and its people like that who make me feel that I'm a sponger, knowing that we are getting X amount for not working, but we CAN'T work, which is a difference, While at the DSS once I saw a young girl whose DS went to preschool with my DS, her DH had had a serious motorbike accident and she had to claim benifit, she hated it too. Feeling like sponger when actually all you are doing is using the welfare benifit system as it should be used. I will be coming back to work when my youngest starts fulltime school, she is 3 atm, so another two years and I am able to become ME again Dh is getting quite restless at home (he has been off fot 15 months now) the Incapity benifit doctor decided he was fit to work and stopped his IB, but his own doctor is refusing to sign him back till he has had physio as they can't operate as it will make it worse Luckily as a Carer I was able to claim Income support, but I would have been out that door down the job centre like a shoot, if my kids didn't have their disablities. I really can't work out why people choose not to work, its boring at home!!

[misdee]

i worry people think we are spongers as well. my dd's, altho not seriously disabled, have been awarded high rate DLA for her their skins probs, allergies, vomiting and dd2 walking situation. dh also gets DLA for his heart condition, tho all but £15 a week (or there abouts) goes towards his car, which is needed as he cant even walk to the gp's surgery which is 5mins way. As i am up most nights with at least one of my dd's, the appt we have for dd's and dh etc, i would be useless working as well. I worked when dd1 ezcema was at its worst, and i had to take so much time off it was unbeliveable. she was having allergic reactions most weeks, was basically a crawling scab (horrible way to describe my child but she was so bad). was on anti biotics, steroids creams, oral seroids, inhalors etc etc. i was a zombie and was falling apart myself. the gp offered to sign me off work as i was so exhausted with it all. two nights ago, i didnt have dd1 special mitten pj's dry in time for bed, so put her in mittenless cotton pj's, 2 hours later she was up screaming in pain as had been scratching in her sleep and made herself sore. her special pj's cost £35ish, and her specials kncikers cost £18 for 3pairs.

I would swop all my benefits and happily go out to work, as would dh, if we could be a 'normal' family.

Another worry we have now, is the fact the govt wants to cut downthe amount of people of Incapcity benefit. dh is unable to work, but we have now seen poeple with the same heart problem as dh who have had theitr benefit stopped. why cant the govt target the ones who are more than likely faking it, than someone with a serious condition that will kill them?

[misdee]

am, also planning to go back to work when kids are at school, or if dh gets better (unlikely but we live in hope) so he can be a SAHD.

[hercules]

The sad thing is if those who could work went to work then there would be enough money to properly support those in genuine need.
Dh and I both work because we can despite having two kids. We couldnt afford childcare for them both so dh took a night job so we would do the childcare between us.
Dh could of course work in a day job, I could stay at home and we could claim benefits.
But we can both work and so therefore feel we should.

Every sympathy with those who cant work for physical or psycholical, carer reasons. The benefit system is there for that purpose.

[TwoIfBySea]

Oh misdee I might have known. You know when I heard they were targetting people on IB me and M, who is on IB were saying how good that was, the govn. was finally doing something.

Of course, they go after those who should be getting it, she recently had to go back to the doctors regarding her claim. I think it is because the ones faking it cause so much trouble, they get away with it due to being to difficult to prove as liars. Therefore people like M, like yourself and others get made to feel awful.

TBH they should be going after those claiming unemployment benefit who just don't want to work.

[mieow]

Both me and DH worked when DS was a baby, between the age of 1-2. DH worked 6-3pm and I then worked from 3:30-7:30 weekday and 8-5 on a saturday, I worked every fourth sunday too. I had to give up work when DS was diagnosed with CP as all the appointments made it hard to work. I would still be working if all the Sh*t in my life hadn't happened.....

[mieow]

Not saying my kids are sh*t by the way, just the CP!!!!

[misdee]

[mieow]

and when you are at the DSS office, you see the same people there, saying their purse has been nicked with all their jobseekers money in it, and the DSS have to give them another giro!! Then a few hours later you see them with their cider and fags, with their drug dealer...... (the DSS is in the next town, a bit of a rough area)

[blossomhill]

Mieow - you really do not have to justify yourself on here my love xxx