Stress and nurseries

[OldieMum]

Article in today's Guardian here

I read this piece just after a conversation with DH when I pointed out how difficult I find it to deal with him when he brings DD home from the nursery and wants to read the paper and/or chat in the way we did before she was born, and I'm left trying to give her my attention and cook at the same time.

[dinosaur]

I read it and thought it was very interesting. I'm in the very lucky position though of not having had to use group daycare for the DSs until they were over two, so I've no personal experience of the effects of daycare on that age-group.

Sounds like DH should either do the cooking or focus his attention on DD! If you don't mind me saying so. I get in from work and am straight into the bath and bedtime routine, don't have any "me" time until they're all in bed (and then I usually cook for me and Dh).

[Donbean]

Interesting but im not altogether convinced of the motive for such an article.
Yes it is stressful for the youngster when they first are separated from the mother. But as toddlers is this not a normal and natural milestone in thier developement?
This so named "separation anxiety" is documented in nearly all of my self help/developmetal books.
My ds has just started play group, he is 2y 2m and is stressed when i drop him off, quite natural as he hasnt been any where without me or his daddy ever.
This was not down to luck but down to my choice. I didnt want to part with him.
(He goes for 2.5 hours twice a week thus a gentle separation for a very short period of time.
I dont feel in the least bit guilty for causing him stress which this article suggests. Because i think its all part of him bieng a normal little boy, and it will pass in time. Im teaching him a valuable lesson IMHO, that he can be independant, he can survive without me at his side and that he must trust that i will always come back for him.
This is in addition to him spreading his social wings and finding his feet amongst his peers.
Certainly food for thought, thanks for showing it to us.

[puddle]

I agree with you Donbean. I would assume that this occurs in all children when they make the transition from home to nursery, whether it is done at 6 months or 3 years.

[melissasmummy]

But children have been staying at home with mums & then attending nurseries for years... so why now (once again to make mothers feel guilty) say such piffle?

A child needs challenges in it's life, it needs to learn that there are going to be times when it has to be somewhere on it's own, it's a vital part of the survival instinct, surely? It needs to know that once left, the parent/caregiver will be back! STRESS? What nonsense!

(apologies to referring to our children as "it's")

[harpsichordcarrier]

hmmm...
yes...
but...
I'm not sure it's right to say that this is "piffle" - and I don't think we can say that the research was done to make mothers feel guilty. I would have been very interested indeed to know about this when I put my dd in nursery at 11 months.
I think it would be really very interesting indeed to see what the differences are between this and other sorts of child care, and to see what could be done to minimise the effects (ad the article suggests).
IMO it's a fairly balanced report and not too hysterical. Not sure if it has been reported elsewhere, would be interesting to see what the Daily Mail makes of it.

[melissasmummy]

Ok, maybe piffle isn't the correct term to use. Nor to say it's to make us feel guilty. It just seems that every so often there is a new "report" that tell us what we belive we are doing right, we are actually doing wrong, or causing our children to be stressed or to be insecure.

How about the stress we experience in trying to raise our children in a manor that will be benefical to them & us & in doing so, trying to make the transition from one environment and or situation to the other as smooth as possible? Because we KNOW already that it will be hard on THEM & US.

Some parents fight with themselves enough as it over many aspects of child care, without being told that a natural progression that their child will have to make will leave them stressed.

Do we really need the "stress" of these reports telling us we are causing our children to be stressed?

[colditz]

we'd all moan like hell if nobody did the reports, we can't have it both ways. We can't just have the reports that validate our choices

[melissasmummy]

I am not saying that we should either, just that every now & then we could do without being told the obvious, IMO

[colditz]

a lot of things should be obvious though. It should be obvious that you shouldn't feed an 8 week old baby scrambled egg, but they had to do reports to stop people doing it.

[OldieMum]

Researchers have a real problem. If they do research which confirms our suspicions, they are accused of proving the obvious. If it's not obvious, then it's assumed to be wrong. I think this research is potentially valuable, as it reassures us that what we observe has a physiological basis (see the thread on Jekyll and Hyde behaviour in the evening) and encourages us to think about how to deal with it. DH has already undertaken to mend his ways!

[harpsichordcarrier]

I don't think it is that obvious though. not to me anyway. We should of course try to support each other's choices, but I really think that this kind of research is very valuable so that we can make "informed" choices and not just fumble around trying to rely on our instincts. it is hard, though, to read something after the fact, when you have already made your choices.

[OldieMum]

What's not explained here is that raised cortisol levels in early childhood can have permanent effects on stress responses later on and that these can be associated with behavioural difficulties. This is why prolonged, raised stress levels in early childhood are something to be concerned about.

[handlemecarefully]

...reassuring though that the article concludes that the raised stress levels were likely to be attributable to the 'novelty' of the new child care arrangements, rather than the unsuitability of the care environment

[puddle]

That's interesting oldiemum - it specifically says in the article that the research is not saying that this is bad, just something to be aware of so that childcare providers can allow for it and try and mitigate it.

[melissasmummy]

Colditz/OldieMum. I guess I see your points. Damned if they do, damned if they don't kinda thing.

Oldiemum, just read your first post again & DH is like that sometimes. Every now & then I'll boot him up the bum and ask him to bath/read to or clean up after dd.

To defend (not argue my point) I just think that SOME of the reports are there to make us feel like bad mothers & just read this one & thought "not another one". But then I guess to some mums it's not always overtly obvious!

[OldieMum]

melissasmummy - I think the Daily Mail does the woman-bashing thing a lot. The Guardian's agenda is more about trying to reform our ridiculous, anti-family long working hours culture.

[melissasmummy]

I suppose thats it Oldiemum, if ever I do read the paper, has to be said, it's The Daily Mail!

I do think I should stop reading it, I do kinda feel that all my good efforts are sometimes being attacked, maybe that's why I reacted as I did to the said report!

[handlemecarefully]

Oh yes Melissamum - do yourself a favour and stop reading it. It will do your blood pressure a world of good! - it's had me incandescent with rage before!

[melissasmummy]

handlemecarefully, me too, but I always find myself leafing thru it. DH brongs it home from work.

Maybe I'll just stick to the Suduko puzzles & the cartoon in future!

[weesaidie]

Ho hum.

My dd - 17 months - is starting nursery next week.

Oh well. Too late now to drop out of uni now.

[saadia]

I think with this kind of research there are a lot of variables that may not have been accounted for, eg what kind of nursery it is, what kind of home life the child has, the child's own innate temperament, all of which must also impact on stress levels

However, if the research conclusions are accurate, then I think it is worrying to think that little 11mo babies experience actual hormonal stress when left at nurseries.

[harpsichordcarrier]

melissasmummy - reading the Daily Mail is clinically proven to raise your cortisol levels to a dangerous extent...
just say no...

[Nightynight]

I can remember the high levels of stress that I experienced when I was first separated from my mother - I was five, and going to school.

This study would be interesting if it made some estimate of what age is best for first separation, in terms of least amount of stress.

[HappyMumof2]

Message withdrawn

[Donbean]

Why does the author of "raising boys" believe that they shouldnt attend day care before the age of 3 HMO2?