Cost of oil or LPG heating

(44 Posts)
LyndaCaerau Tue 01-Jan-13 22:11:37

Hi this is my first post and wondered if anyone could help me. We are hoping to move house further into the countryside but I have noticed that most of the houses are either heated using LPG or Oil, I have been told that this is very expensive. I just wondered what people's experience of this is, what the costs are in comparison to mains gas, many thanks

poshme Thu 03-Jan-13 17:47:09

And there is somewhere a website that directly compares the different costs per kWh of different fuels- can't find it now cos on my phone but I originally found it through googling. (we heat our house entirely from wood)

Dromedary Thu 03-Jan-13 19:19:10

Sorry Piglet, but you are incorrect. Inhalable glass fibres are CURRENTLY classified as "reasonably anticipated to be a human carcinogen" by the US Department of Health - I have just checked this definition on their website.

The animal studies showed a substantial increase in cancer (eg lung and leukemia) in exposed animals. The studies of factory workers showed an increased risk, varying with gender, length of exposure and period from first exposure.
The reason why there has been no study of insulation installers (who are exposed to far higher levels) is apparently because it is the kind of work where workers don't tend to stay with the same employer for long, which complicates this kind of research.
Needless to say there is a lot of lobbying and publicity from the glass fibre industry to convince the public that there is no risk. Many of these manufacturers were apparently previously in the asbestos fibre industry. As you probably know, asbestos was widely used for many decades, despite the industry knowing that it caused cancer. It is still mined in Canada and other places and sold to the developing world. It is anticipated that millions of workers in the developing world will die in consequence of this.
I found out about this because I had an asbestos survey done on my property. 2 asbestos consultants from separate specialist companies warned me, without my asking the question (I had no idea) that glass fibres are considered to be very high risk. One of them recommended that if and when I had a new roof put on I get all the insulation removed from the roof.

If you want to run this kind of risk that's up to you, but you should not encourage others to do so.

I am not interested in discussing this issue further with you - I don't have the time to find the links for someone who can't be bothered to look them up for him or herself.

LyndaCaerau Thu 03-Jan-13 20:38:21

Thanks Poshme when you say it was hassle can you tell me what and warmer does that mean you don't need a jumper? Just trying to work out just how warm they are, and thanks everyone for all your comments and coatings for oil it does vary quite a bit

PigletJohn Thu 03-Jan-13 20:38:42

I looked up what links I could, but am not in the US so the US Department of Health is not one I easily see. I can however see the IARC which is part of WHO.

When I just searched US Department of Health website I couldn't see the document you mention.

I don't know why, if that is indeed the case, the US Department of Health is still working on 1990 assumptions rather than 2001 evidence.

As youi don't wish to discuss it I suppose I will never know.

poshme Thu 03-Jan-13 21:17:45

Hi OP. Their ground source is from pipes dug under the ground in a field. If you want ground source you either need a large area to put pipes in, or the ability to drill down very deep (I think). Either way, lots of digging/big machines. Then you have to install the pumps into your house (theirs looks like a giant freezer). Apparently it works more efficiently with undergloor heating, but they don't have that.
Their house is warm, sometimes warm enough for no jumper even in winter but usually there i'd now wear top & thin jumper. However, their house is VERY big and draughty (no double glazing, stone Walls) so I think in a normal house it'd be definitely warm enough.
It is very expensive to install.

poshme Thu 03-Jan-13 21:22:11

Oh, and they had to change their electricity to 3-phase (no idea what that means)!
You can also get air source heat pumps that take warmth from the air. I think they make a noise though.

Dromedary Thu 03-Jan-13 21:23:16

Piglet - it's all on the internet. It took me about 1 minute to find the Department of Health site with the relevant reference - just type in the obvious terms. They have recently reviewed the decision to classify the risk that way, and changed the wording slightly, while deciding that the risk continued to justify the classification. I have read a document explaining this decision dated 2011.
By the way, it has been in the news recently that lung cancer rates have gone up hugely - this includes the rates in people who have never smoked, in particular women. The research on glass fibres indicated that women are at far higher risk (apparently it is similar for the risk of lung cancer caused by smoking - women are more susceptible).
I agree that more research is needed. What is not needed is someone who encourages others to install glass fibre insulation on a DIY basis without mentioning the issue of risk, and poo-pooing of people who consider that there is or may be a risk.
Go and poo-poo at the US Department of Health if you want to.

SizzleSazz Thu 03-Jan-13 21:27:08

We have a 4 bed, not particularly well insulated house.

We usually fill our oil tank (1000 litres) twice a year - use 1 tank in 4 months over winter and the other lasts 8 months. Costs about £600-£650 to fill so £1,200 p.a or £100 per month which seems ok to me.

Loshad Thu 03-Jan-13 22:17:31

LPG is a pain in the bum, tied into one supplier, unexploded bomb in garden shock
During the winter our lpg bills range from £400-270 per month, we have the heating on for a couple of hours per day, though plenty of baths.
We cook on electric.
(large 5/6 bed detached)

Loshad Thu 03-Jan-13 22:18:45

poshme, yes one day will move to ground source heat (eyes up unbought lottery tickets)

PigletJohn Fri 04-Jan-13 01:09:16

Dromedary

I've shown you the links I've found, and you haven't disproved what they say.

If you've been able to find some alternative evidence, especially supporting the allegation that glassfibre is like asbestos, let's see it.

For the moment all I see is unsupported claims. I love facts and evidence.

I lived in a draughty old, poorly insulated house with high ceilings and a large cellar and wooden/laminate floors. We were never warm, tried to use the oil as little as possible too. It was very expensive for us, but we were renting. If it had been our own house we could have sorted insulation, had wood burners installed (money permitting), but with the high ceilings most of the hot air was above head height.

LyndaCaerau Fri 04-Jan-13 19:51:30

Thanks Poshme that's really helpful, it gives us some hope that we could always change over to ground source when we save some money. Also thanks again to all who have posted really really useful, cheers

Lozislovely Fri 04-Jan-13 22:58:01

You could always call National Grid tel:0845 835 1111 and they can tell you if there are any plans to put mains gas into that area in the future, may help sway your decision????

JessAst Tue 29-Jan-13 11:19:41

Does anyone have any good experience of any other suppliers? Is www.heatingoil.co.uk any good?! Just moved into first oil heated house like you Lynda and very clueless!

specialsubject Tue 29-Jan-13 11:42:37

Last fill up I phoned round all the local suppliers, plus got boilerjuice and heatingoil quotes - and the depot down the road were the cheapest. But it varies greatly with area and there is no other way than by shopping round each time. You can't normally buy less than 500 litres, sometimes (not always) buying more is cheaper. Standing orders lock you to one supplier and don't allow you to shop around, best bet if you need to budget is to put away a certain amount each month for the oil in an interest-paying account. Every little helps, as they say.

boilerjuice has a price chart so you can see what the price is doing. Don't buy in a snowy spell or just before Christmas.

one thing that catches out new oil users; the gauge on the side does not drop as fast as the tank level! Pull out the valve on the bottom and the 'float' will then show you the actual level - plenty of people have been caught by this and run out, although you only do it once. :-)

Merrylegs Tue 29-Jan-13 11:50:18

Have you got an oil club in your area, JessAst?

It's a way of buying oil a little cheaper because you order at the same time as your neighbours. (Although ime whenever you order they will deliver!)

Also they don't charge for using a credit card.

If not you could get a quote from them and then call your local depot and if they are more expensive give them your cheaper quote and they will almost always match it or undercut it.

(Current oil price in my area, fyi is about 64p a litre)

JessAst Tue 29-Jan-13 14:46:14

I think there might be a few oil clubs around me but haven't had much of a chance to have a look around yet. Will have to get researching!

Thanks for the info smile

Moredofbumsnet Tue 29-Jan-13 14:52:33

We have a 3 bed semi and use approx 1000l of lpg per year. We have a woodburner too and cook on electric. So our lpg cots about £600 per year.We have the heating on about 5 hours a day except in very cold weather.Lpg is a pain as you have to pay up front,can run out and never can be sure you are getting a good price. Our neighbours are really happy with their new electric boiler.

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