Is this PND?

[Snuffles]

Am regular mumsnetter (think cat's noise) but changed my name as dh knows it and I think may search on it occasionally (not that I have a problem with that, but not ready to talk to him about this yet). So I don't mind you knowing who I am but please don't mention my name thanks.

My question is about PND. Ds is 14 weeks old now, and up until very recently, I have been fine (and I really do mean fine, not just hiding-the-truth-from-myself fine). But in the past few days - about three or four - I have felt very different. It's taken me over 24 hours to muster up the wherewithal to type this message, which is unlike me. I am finding it hard to motivate myself to do anything, I just want to "opt out" of life just now. Ds is still night-feeding and I know that physically that is taking its toll, but it's more than that. It's like the quality of my life experiences has changed, I'm seeing everything through a different coloured filter...ok I'm rambling now, but I've never felt like this before and I'm finding it very disconcerting!

Anyhow, I know that 1. it's only been a few days and maybe I should wait a little while and see how I feel, and 2. the only thing to do really is to see the GP, but I don't want to be put on AD's as a precaution if that's not what is wrong. Maybe I'm just very tired at the moment.

Sorry, really rambling here. It helps to write it down.

[PiccadillyCircus]

From my own experiences of depression what you're saying about wanting to "opt out" and feeling that things are through a different coloured filter (possibly a grey one?) sound as if it could be symptoms of depression.

But also it could be general tiredness. I have an 8 week DD and when I am up in the night more I can feel symptoms similar to depression.

I am on ADs at the moment fro depression that was diagnosed in March and they have and do really help me.

[Snuffles]

Thanks PC. I have no problems with going on ADs if it's needed, but am a little reluctant to go to the GP if I'm going to end up on them as a precaution.

Also a little unsure if PND would rear its head at this stage - I would have thought that it would strike earlier or not at all?

Also it's not affecting my bonding with ds, I don't resent him at all...sorry, really don't know much about this, I am floundering around.

I also think I am making a mountain out of a molehill atm, another reason for not wanting to talk to dh atm!

[hunkermunker]

Hi Snuffles () - is there any chance that you could be given a "break" where all you do is feed DS and sleep? I know it might be hard to organise, but you'd have a better idea then if it's general tiredness or something that does need help x x x x x

[Laura032004]

Hia - it might help if you can find the Edinburgh test somewhere on the internet and have a go at completing that. That will give you a good indication (IMO) of how low you are feeling. I didn't realise how low I was until I scored v.highly on the test.

Maybe do it today, and repeat in a week or so, to see if things seem to be improving or getting worse.

Agree it's prob. too early to think about seeing a GP or anything. Try your best to get lots of rest, make life as easy as poss (thinking go easy on hwk, lots of ready meals, sleep whenever DS sleeps...) and do fun things, and see if this helps to lift you.

If you're not feeling better in a week or so, then reevaluate then. Don't leave it, and try and talk to your DH. Does he have any idea how you are feeling? Little things can make a big difference, so maybe if he knows he can help out more for a while?

HTH a little

[Bozza]

I'm no expert snuffles but it sounds like you are very tired. Is there anyway of getting extra rest, maybe at the weekend and then if that has not helped go to the doctor on Monday. Even if he prescribes ADs you don't have to take them until you are sure that is the way to go. I do wonder if it is 14 weeks of cumulative sleep deprivation that is taking its toll.

[Snuffles]

Thanks everyone, hiya hunker

Thing is, dh does everything, looks after the dds, cooks all the meals, gets everyone up for school in the morning ... all I have to do is look after ds and me! So I've no excuse really!

I'm finding it very hard to sleep atm though, apart from the night sleeps ds sleeps like a dream, but I lie awake for hours - not sure whether this is cause or effect (affect?) IYKWIM.

[Snuffles]

Can't find the Edinburgh test online, though I have seen it before ... can anyone help me find a link?

[Laura032004]

www.childbirthsolutions.com/articles/postpartum/epds/index.php

[Laura032004]

Sorry, here it is

Scroll down the page for the questionnaire.

[PiccadillyCircus]

I've found a link to it here although I'm not sure it says what different scores indicate.

There's a website with more information on PND here as well

[Snuffles]

Thanks - will have a go now.

[Enid]

I absolutely think that it is tiredness as I felt very like this when dd2 was about 5 months old. I was also terribly weepy. I notice that when I have disturbed nights I always feel depressed. God knows how I will cope with number 3 in May!

Anyway, sleep definitely helped - I also got to a stage where I couldnt sleep even though I was exhausted. My hv recommended I go to bed at 8pm which I did, even though I still woke in the night with dd2 and also lay awake from 3-5 every morning, at least I had had a few uninterrupted hours from 8-11pm. After a week this really started to help. I had to make myself relax instead of running around when baby was sleeping in the day and insist that dh helped more. I also had acupunture and gave up breastfeeding ().

After an awful couple of months, during which I found out my brother was a heroin addict , I started to feel so much better.

Hope any of this helps.

[Snuffles]

Thanks Enid. Well, I only score 12 on the Edinburgh Test so I think you are right really! I agree about tiredness making you feel depressed too. I didn't have PND when the other two were born but have a history of mild depression (as a teenager), which is perhaps why I was/am concerned.

I think it's partly that, having got to this stage (ie 14 weeks after the birth), I expected to be feeling better, not worse (hah!) - but then previously my db's had been sleeping through at this stage.

[Enid]

I felt brilliant until about 17 weeks then it hit me like an express train.

Although just tiredness it is bloody awful and prob not much to choose between it and depression - although I could still have a laugh and also loved both dds desperately.

Glad I didnt take anti-ds in the end though.

[Marina]

Snuffles, really sorry to hear this. Agree with everyone who says it could be a big fatigue issue, especially heading into month four of night feeding. It takes its toll.
How have you got on with the Edinburgh Test and do you have a HV as first port of call, rather than going straight to your GP if you are hesitant about doing so?
Also wondered if getting your iron/thyroid levels might be relevant, feline friend? Can you get hold of (or bear to drink ) Floradix? Or a good postnatal vit supp? I also found fish oil supplements helped me feel slightly less addled post dd.

[Marina]

x-posted with you and enid, that is good news about the Edinburgh Test (but I have to say, who ever answers some of those questions REALLY positively after they've had a baby FGS!)
Tireness is still vile though, and lowering, especially in winter when you can't loaf about in the sunshine.

[Enid]

I made myself worse torturing myself that I had PND and I would suddenly go mad and kill myself

no wonder I was knackered

[Pruni]

Message withdrawn

[Enid]

yes

the force was weak in me at 17 weeks

dreading it next time ho hum

[Snuffles]

Thanks Marina - yes I am lucky to have a really fab hv, and I had wondered about asking her - I'm seeing her on Friday for a baby massage class but am scared of even asking her to come and see me as I think I will just burst into tears in front of everyone else!! Hopefully I will be in a better frame of mind on Friday though.

Enid - express train - yup that's just how it feels.

[Snuffles]

I'm not alone, am I? I bet I went through a period of this when the dds were tiny, but have forgotten about it as it was such a long time ago!

I think I am maybe trying too hard to be Mrs ICanCope, as I want to have a fourth fairly soon - and obviously if I am struggling now it will be worse when I have a toddler to entertain as well as a small baby, and I am (secretly) worried dh will say let's not have a fourth, it'll be too hard for you....argh

[Enid]

lol Mrs I can cope

thats what did for me, its the absolute worst thing you can do to yourself. I had to learn to be needy it wasnt easy believe me!

[Marina]

Hm, hence the subterfuge, Snuffles.
And boy do I know the feeling of having forgotten about the zombie state due to a larger than average age gap.
You know, I am sure you will not be the only teary one at the session on Friday if the babies are all roughly the same age. I can remember sitting in a circle all snuffling away with bags under our eyes at our 4-month postnatal support group. We were all thoroughly grateful to the mum who was the first to crack and sent up the flare for us all to start blubbing...honestly.

[Snuffles]

Yes I think I am a victim of my own optimism

Ds has just woken up and is singing - I could forgive him anything, he is so delightful!

Thank you so much for your support folks, I feel so much better for talking about it. I am going to go back to being "me" now (but not on this thread obviously).