self harmers - a question

[Tortington]

if you have children and you self harm so badly that you go to hospital - are other agencies involved automatically?

tiz just a ponder - i don't self harm, so this is a genuine question

[Flamesparrow]

I would assume so - afaik the hospital have to contact the mental health team, who then would do something about the children.

But that is just assumption.

(like the new blue announcement.... it could be old , but like it anyway)

[Tortington]

no, its new

thanks fs

anymore

[Tortington]

is there a definative answer?

[Flamesparrow]

Looks like tis just us and our musings!

[Tortington]

indeed!

[Flamesparrow]

bump!

[Tortington]

awwwwwwww how nice is that?

[littlepig]

I suspect this would come under Child Protection (in Scotland at least) in which case any healthcare professional that came across the situation would be obliged to report it

[Tortington]

am just wondering, becuase i have been reading a thread - not naming names - but repeated self harm and hospitalisation.

the family clearly need intervention - if indeed its true

which is what i dont get? surely if you had repeatedly been hospitalised - the poor baby would be 'at risk'

[Barnical]

I don't know much about this.. but from what I do know..self harmers tend to self harm because they can't express their issues any other way .. so long as not PG I'm guessing it shouldn't put DC at risk?

But I could be talking out of my bum... usually do

[Flamesparrow]

I have had similar concerns on some threads. It has made me have doubts about the posters. Obv it is just doubts, and I have no idea if they are the same threads etc, so please don't doubt on me say so

[TotalChaos]

I don't think agencies are involved automatically. I think with self-harm they tend to be more concerned if you are self-harming in front of the children. I know of ladies who have had stays in hospital for mental health reasons without social services being involved.

[Barnical]

It's not something you would really want to advertise tho.. surely they only end up in hospital becuase they made a mistake and took it too far.. I can't see that they would do this too often just in case ss got involved??

[TotalChaos]

I have some limited personal experience of trying to get SS to get involved and help a friend (different issues), and it was very hard indeed to get them interested. So I wouldn't feel comfortable with presuming that because SS didn't seem to be involved that people were not telling the truth about hospitalisations etc.

[Flamesparrow]

Seriously? they don't get involved automatically if someone is hurting themselves enough to need treatment and are in charge of children??

Does it make a difference if there is a partner/close family etc?

[mylittlepudding]

Many "self harmers" don't have a mental illness. They might be taking care of their children that ranges from excellent to terrible. It is a coping mechanism, unlike alcohol and drugs it doesn't diminish mental capacity; unlike spending and many other 'addictions' it doesn't take away from the children.

So, no, it shouldn't be automatic. It depends on the background I guess. You aren't automatically referred to other agencies if you are classified as having 'severe mental illness' either. It's case by case basis, I believe.

Which I guess can lead to people slipping through the cracks - maybe Custardo's case is a case in point.

[mylittlepudding]

Many "self harmers" don't have a mental illness. They might be taking care of their children that ranges from excellent to terrible. It is a coping mechanism, unlike alcohol and drugs it doesn't diminish mental capacity; unlike spending and many other 'addictions' it doesn't take away from the children.

So, no, it shouldn't be automatic. It depends on the background I guess. You aren't automatically referred to other agencies if you are classified as having 'severe mental illness' either. It's case by case basis, I believe.

Which I guess can lead to people slipping through the cracks - maybe Custardo's case is a case in point.

[mylittlepudding]

Sorry, the double posting was a mistake.

[peacelily]

I don't think each case would neccssarily involve statutory agenceis there are many other variable that need to be added up such aswhther it's in front of the children, whther it's done in a vengeful way towards the children (this is extremely rare) and whther ther was a suitable other carer living with the children and degree and impairment of mental faculties. How much other "chaos" was going on at home (rows, drug/alcohol abuse/etc).

most individulas who self harm do not have a diagnosable mental illness, the people I've met feel extremely gulity and ashamed about it and keep it secret from their dcs. The vast majority would never to anything directly to cause their dcs emptional or physical harm.

Involvement of statutory services would be carefully assessed by the mental health team and referrals made on if neccessary

[smurfgirl]

Well I have been to A&E a fair bit for self harm - nobody has ever asked me if I have children (I don't), and sometimes aside from my name I have given them no info what so ever. They can't make you see anyone usually.

[laidbackinengland]

Evening Custardo, I work in a self harm team and we pick up nearly all our referrals from A and E. Someone's self harm per se would not mean an automatic referral to Social Services - although we obviusly follow the Child Protection guidelines and look at each individual case. The things that would more likely initiate a referral (in addiotion to other more obvious citeria) are

1. No other adult at home to care for child if the parent self harms - particularly if the parents self harm involves overdosing.

1. Co-existing serious substance misuse

1. Child regularly witnessing self harm

1. Regular high levels of emotional distress in the home

Hope this helps.

[laidbackinengland]

Sorry about typos ...long and emotional day at work !

[Flamesparrow]

That helps a lot laidback (I have family concerns as well as online ones and have had soooo many times banging my head against a wall wondering why no-one is stepping in )

[Tortington]

thanks! v. helpful

[naswm]

thank you for giving the official line laidback.