Anyone know about CHB rights?

[MerrythuluDestroyerofMincePies]

Split in 2005, with 2 dc's (now 10 and 14). I was (and am still) primary carer, XP has never applied for legal responsibility, but has (on his request) 50% shared care. Disregarding other problems, such as us giving him undeserved settlement money, problems over his lack of responsibility for school runs, child care and clubs, not paying any maintenance until I finally went to the CSA in 2010, a spat which got as far as mediation when we thought we were going to have to move for DH's work, etc etc, things have been fairly amicable, well, as far as they can be.
A couple of weeks ago, we were having a parenting meeting for the term ahead. XP brought his brother with him, and said that he has to move out of his parents house. They haven't asked him to move out, he just wants to move out. But he doesn't earn that much, and explained that he can't claim Child Tax Credit unless he is receiving the Child Benefit for that child. So he asked if he could claim the Child Benefit for one of the children 'as that would be fair'.
Now, bear in mind he got the best part of two mortgage extensions when he was here, that he has just walked away from leaving me (and therefore DH) to pay; that we gave him £11000 settlement money for a house he had no rights to, name not on mortgage, never paid more than the interest payments, etc etc; that he didn't pay any maintenance for the kids until two years ago; that despite me giving him his first month's rent for a flat, he could not sustain himself in a house sharing with another single dad friend, and so chose to move back home with his parents; that he actually relies on his parents for much of the parenting jobs, such as school runs, looking after them until he gets home from work, doing the washing, cooking etc.
Do you agree with us that, aside from CHB effectively being my pension, we should say no? Obviously losing the Tax Credit and CHB would be a considerable chunk of loss for us, and would have a huge effect on our monthly budget. We pay for all clothes, school uniform and equipment (several times over, as it is left at Dad's house and never returns) as well, so I'm worried that this will end up with the kids not getting stuff bought for them. Please, if you disagree, don't flame me, I'm just genuinely worried that this will blow up into a massive argument again, and we can't afford mediation!

[olgaga]

There is absolutely no way you should give up claiming child benefit, it affects your Home Responsibilities Protection/NICs etc.

This man has to stand on his own two feet. He has been skiving off you and his own family for far too long it seems to me, and if he moves out of his parents' home he'll only waste that money and get into financial difficulty once again.

The child benefit and tax credits help you pay for things for the children which you couldn't otherwise pay for. Presumably he shares care so that he doesn't have to pay you maintenance?

What are the children's views on these shared care arrangements?

My advice would be say no!

[MerrythuluDestroyerofMincePies]

DH and I have always thought that the reason why he wants the kids 50% is so that he has to pay the least amount of maintenance, although of course he would vehemently deny it!
The kids - well, they're kids aren't they? They adore their dad, and have always seen him as the victim, as that's the way he paints it to them. Although DD is now 14 and is beginning to see the truth. She's said to me that she's worried about him being able to cope on his own without Grandad and Grandma to help him, and that their moving out would only work if they moved somewhere nearby!
I think we're waiting for him to bring it up again - we left it that 'we will consider his request, check our finances and see what we could do, and talk about it in a few weeks'. (Although both DH and I were thinking, 'you cheeky fucker, there's absolutely no way'!)

[olgaga]

'you cheeky fucker, there's absolutely no way'!

Quite - seems to me a flat refusal in view of your own finances and the needs of the children is the best way. His finances (ie inability to manage money) are his. Very sad that he has your 14 year old DD worrying about him...

[Collaborate]

He'd have to apply to the CB office in Newcastle to transfer the CB.

From what I can see (from the outside looking in - never been invilved in the process) they would consider the shared care aspect, but also consider who pays for what. The problem from your perspective is that if he gets CB then he'd have to put his hand in his packet to pay for things for the children you won't then be able to afford.

I simply don't know how the CB office would deal with it. Hopefully someone who's been through the same process will come along.

[Xenia]

I would not agree if I were you and he cannot force it. Perhaps he could just try to take a second job and work hard like the rest of us.

[MerrythuluDestroyerofMincePies]

Thanks ladies - I've just done my own tax return today and realised how little I earnt between September 2011 and August 2012 so I can tell him right royally where to go now, I think!
I was aware that if I say no he'll have to go to the CHB office but yes, Collaborate, I'm not sure what they'd say - does any (kind, lovely, lick-lick) MNer know the score on this one?

And oh god, I REALLY need to namechange - it's so last year, isn't it?

[fuzzywuzzy]

child benefit goes to the main carer. If your ex wants to change that without your consent he will have to prove he's the main carer I suppose.

Also I'm not sure about this, but you might lose CSA for that child and he could claim CSA off you for one child if he ends up with the CHB.

[Xenia]

If the children live mostly with you you get the child benefit and any tax credits. The state will not divide it between you which is in fact terribly unfair on the person who has them say 3 days out of 7 so some parents choose to divide it up through an adjustment in payments between themselves. Dioes not sound like a case for that here.

If one child goes to live with him then things reverse - you pay CSA support for that child and he gets the CB and tax credits for that child.

[Collaborate]

If care is shared 50/50 the CSA do not carry out an assessment against either parent.

[MerrythuluDestroyerofMincePies]

Thanks for this - this is all useful stuff. He says that he has them 50/50, but we're the ones who have the kids when their off school sick, for INSET days, and for most of the holidays when he's working, so I think he'd have a hard job to prove that he's the main carer. He has them overnight though for 2 or 5 nights a week, depending on the week. To be honest, I hate this routine, I don't think it works logistically, I think it just means that the kids are never in either place for long enough to feel settled, or they just get settled and have to change again, but there seems to be bugger all I can do about it. In fact, I'd go so far as I think it's causing the kids to behave differently in each house, down to adapting different mannerisms and phrases, tones of voice and behaviours, but I suppose that's nothing new and must happen with a lot of cases with two homes. When DH and I first split up, equal parenting seemed the way to go, but 8 years on, I have to say I don't think it's actually been the best for the children. Of course it's important for them to see their Dad and have a relationship with him, and I have respected his wishes (and theirs,) in going along with it, but I do worry (as I always have,) that it's actually not what they need.

[Xenia]

Equal parenting does work for a lot of people and some children ilke it as they have fair amounts with each parent. It is not a bad thing to be used to different standards and indeed in school children have to get to a different regime again.

I suspect the children like seeing both parents and this dispute is all about money - who keeps the child benefit. If the children are on the whole more with him than you then he should be getting the child benefit and tax credits. When the children are about 13 they can choose anyway and might choose to live all the time with him or with you so you really need to be planning for the longer term and not changing things if the children would not ilke it. I think you have both done really well in splitting things well. It sounds like the fact he is now part time is the real problem as it is so hard to find full time work so if he has much less money now and the children are mostly with him but you claim the CB he does not get the child tax credits and perhaps even housing benefit he might get were he the CB recipient. One solution is help him find a full time job and then the issue is resolved.

If both families could increase their earnings (not easy in this recession) that would solve most of the issues I suspect.

[Daddelion]

If it's 50-50 I don't see why he can't claim child benefit for one child.
We split the child benefit 50-50 and don't claim CSA from each other.
I also don't see what it has got to do with your husband.

In your posts you do come across as it being about you losing money, sorry if that's not a true reflection.

What do you mean by the CHB being your pension?
Mine pays for school dinners.

Have you got plans in place for when all the benefits stop?
As at 12 and 14 that's not that far away.

[Xenia]

It's difficult without knowing the background. Some people do go part time to avoid paying for their children. I come across it all the time. One man was showing off to me that he now earns very very little so he does not have to pay much to the ex wife. Another 2 weeks ago told me he made sure all the money was in trust so the soon to be ex gets virtually nothing. Some remarry and ensure they dont' work but the new wife does so that the CSA sums are nothing as they are based on husband's salary not his new wife's.

On the other hand this chap may just be a victim of the recession and has not gone part time to avoid paying for children. If he's part time he will have a lot more time so may be all the children's washing could be shipped to him bags each week and he could take on more duties like taking them to buy school uniform.