Please help me, feeling so down

(55 Posts)
iwanticecream Mon 08-Apr-13 16:12:44

Right, will try not to make this too long.

I had a c section with my dd almost 13 years ago. I had an extreme fear of natural birth which wasn't helped by some appaling and humiliating treatment in my pregnancy. After I broke down and had a panic attack during an examination at 31 weeks, I was finally seen by a consultant who agreed to a section, which was wonderful, no probs.

I have had such a fear that I have waited all these years to try again. Panic that has gripped me in the night for years. Am now 11 weeks.

I have hired a private midwife, have seen her once, she know my fears, has said she'd help me re a repeat section but at the moment she's proving to be as useless as a chocolate teapot really, already thinking that i've chucked 3k down the drain, but I can't be at the mercy of a hospital midwife team again.

She is now saying that the 3 hospitals she contacted will push me for a VBAC and will probably not agree to a second section on my request.

I am thinking of terminating this pregnancy, I cannot have a natrual birth, I don't know what to do.

CuppaCiggieBiccieBliss Mon 08-Apr-13 17:58:42

iwanticecream, I'm not able to give any useful advice but I am also in a similar situation.
I am unable to have a natural birth due to extreme fear of examinations due to past abuse. My dd was born 4 years ago by elcs and I'm now 11 weeks pregnant.
I too thought of terminating as the fear of them saying no to a section was terrifying.
I'm not sure if it's different depending on areas but my midwife said that as I'd had a previous csection I'd be offered one automatically. Has your midwife said different?

CuppaCiggieBiccieBliss Mon 08-Apr-13 18:00:44

Also meant to say, feel free to pm anytime for a rant, moan or cry, it's so hard being in this situation and want you to know that you're not alone brew thanks

DoodleAlley Mon 08-Apr-13 18:07:40

As far as I am aware if a consultant will not have you a c section you are entitled to ask to be referred to a consultant who will.

I am having an elcs this week due to trauma from first birth.

mayhew Mon 08-Apr-13 18:35:44

Ask for a referral to the nearest perinatal mental health team. They have no vested interest in avoiding CS but aim to get you to the other side of child-bearing in one piece. Your condition is called tokophobia ie extreme fear of pregnancy and childbirth. Your GP or mw can refer you. You may be able to self refer.You would be seen by a psychologist who will have seen this before. At 11 weeks, you have time on your side.

You can do your own research about services or you can contact a Supervisor of Midwives at your local maternity unit. It is their responsibility to support women to get the care they need. They can advocate for you with the obstetric team. The unit should have a website with contact details.

You will get your section, purely on the grounds that you had one previously, never mind the other issues. Don't panic and don't arrange a termination. You just need to speak to a consultant and take somebody as an advocate with you if you don't think you can do it alone.

Beatrixpotty Tue 09-Apr-13 07:24:51

So sad that termination has crossed your mind because of this.Having had 1 section already is a good enough reason to request another and can have on nhs,no need to pay private fees.You need a referral to see a consultant in antenatal clinic,your GP can do it or midwife.Normally see you at 20weeks to discuss & 36 to bo

Beatrixpotty Tue 09-Apr-13 07:26:43

Sorry,36 weeks to book date.Good luck

MrsMargoLeadbetter Tue 09-Apr-13 08:28:06

Hi

iwanticecream so sorry you are feeling like this.

I am no expert (so not sure how helpful this is) but I would imagine that NHS consultants wouldn't confirm to a private midwife (or anyone else outside the NHS on your behalf) that they will definitely give you a ELCS without seeing you especially as it is fairly early on.

As others have said get booked in and ask to see a consultant and take your private midwife along to that.

You have a valid reason for a ELCS. Anyone I know who has wanted one (all in different places) have been given one.

Do you have people you can talk to in RL about this?

Thinking of you.

iwanticecream Tue 09-Apr-13 08:38:17

Hi, sorry I didn't come back yesterday, wasn't feeling too good.

The time frame is worrying me. I cannot have vaginal birth, and I don't want the fear hanging over me, I would rather terminate. I spent my first pregnancy gripped with fear and anxiety, I couldn't leave the house, I couldn't breathe until they agreed a section.

My midwife is also stressing me out beyond belief. SHes tried telling me what bloods I MUST have, what tests I MUST have (believe me, I know my rights and what is optional, what is my choice), I can't beleive I have paid all this money for someone to cause me stress. She's been no help with any of this either.

My three neasrest hospitals are trying to get their c section rates down, apparently they would only consider me for a vbac.

Can you ditch the midwife? She should be informing you and supporting you, not pressuring you.

All hospitals are trying to get their section rates down, my own hospital only has a 17% rate that they are very proud of but they still don't force VBAC on anyone and agreed to my elective immediately. I think you need to engage with the actual hospital, speak to a consultant and not rely on what this midwife or what anyone else says. If you are honest about your fears I am sure they will listen to you and agree to your section at an early stage. If you don't get anywhere with the first consultant you see, request to see another. Get someone to support you and attend appointments if need be - can your partner not help?

RubyrooUK Tue 09-Apr-13 08:57:43

Sorry this is upsetting you so much. I think if you are considering termination rather than go through childbirth again, this is something that should (and may well) be taken very seriously by your hospital.

Your private midwife doesn't sound very supportive. Have you spoken to the hospital midwives at all? I know you found them bad last time, but it may be very different this time. I found all my NHS midwives very supportive in obtaining a section. Have you been booked in yet at the hospital?

At my hospital, I was booked in about 11 weeks and scanned at 12 weeks with DS2. At my booking in appointment, I spoke to the midwife about my previous traumatic birth and resulting injuries and explained that I wanted to see a consultant about a c section.

I saw the consultant at 16 weeks and he had no hesitation in recommending a section in my circumstances. I found no battle at all, although my hospital is also hoping to cut their section rates. Where are you living, OP?

This thread here explains how the OP saw a consultant and was successfully able to campaign for a section with the help of a specialist NHS midwife.

Please don't despair. Keep talking to us and there will be a way to handle this.

iwanticecream Tue 09-Apr-13 09:13:17

If I get rid of this midwife, I am not sure I will get my money back.

I've not booked at the hospital yet. The midwife spoke to three and said two wouldn't even talk to her about it and said they would not do cs on maternal request anymore. The third said I could see the midwife there to talk about it, but it is one of the worst hospitals in london with an appaling track record. It's actually due for closure soon it's that terrible.

I am so confused and I don't know what to do for the best.

I'm sorry but I don't believe what the midwife is saying. The NICE guidelines say that maternal choice is allowed, yes they will try to dissuade some women (typically first timers who are frightened of pain), but you have already had a CS and therefore have valid clinical reasons for having another. This is before you even go into your psychological issues over it all.

If I were you I would go to your booking in app and discuss all the issues and see what they say. At this point you can request a consultant appointment too.

Also, I would see your GP and tell them how down this is making you. You might benefit from a mental health service referral anyway to help you with the anxiety.

I really feel for you though, I was in a similar state until 32 weeks and I wish I had just spoken to my consultant earlier. Everyone kept telling me I wouldn't be allowed an elective, including my family, yet it was no problem at all, despite there being no clinical reason and it being purely psychological. You are very different as you actually have a clear clinical reason.

iwanticecream Tue 09-Apr-13 09:56:33

I need to talk to this midwife properly, don't I? Kick her into line, I have paid her all my savings.

I went with a private one in the first place as I was treated so terribly in my first pregnancy, but she just seems crap. All she cares about is ramming every test under the sun down my throat saying they are compulsory - I know they are not and it's giving me loads of stress.

I am seeing my gp soon.

Ladyhawke127 Tue 09-Apr-13 10:43:59

Grrrrrr! Right! I am so sorry that ou are being made to feel this way! I had the same problem in so much as I just didn't want to give birth and I was put under an immense amount of pressure to have a vaginal delivery. You are entitled under the NICE guidelines to have a section for maternal request. I ad I really dig my heels in and had a really ard fight, but I did eventually have my section. I think that I only had the courage of my convictions because I am a health care professional myself, but I still found it incredibly difficult. I felt really bullied and belittled at times. Hang in there. Ask to see the consultant and tell thm that it is your body and hey are risking not only your physical health but mental health also by dictating to you how you will give birth. They will tell you about the risks involved - haemorrhage, increased isk of deep vein thrombosis, wound infection, and possible minor breathing difficulties your baby might have (usually if born but section under 37 weeks by section) all of which are true and you must be aware of. You will have a spinal anaesthetic for your section, meaning that you will be awake for he birth of your baby. You will have to have bloods taken to make sure that your blood chemistry is fine before they start and to make sure that they have your blood type on hand should they need it. ( this is all standard procedure, and nothing o be worried about) hs is usually done the day before your section is planned. Your partner will be able to come into theatre with ou to see his baby being born too. You will still be able to breast feed after a section, if that is what you want. I can tell you all this, as I work in obstetrics operating theatre and have helped the anaesthetists with loads of them, and have been through it myself 9 months ago. Good luck.

Ladyhawke127 Tue 09-Apr-13 10:46:25

You do not need any more test throughout your pregnancy than an anyone else does, just because you are having a section. I work for the nhs and am really proud to do so. I hope you can find it within you to give them another go.

It might be worth exploring how much money you can get back as she had only done a very small amount of what the overall service presumably involves. I don't think you need her, I think you can get more appropriate support from various parts of the NHS. I can completely understand why you hired her but I think you will be fine without her.

I'm glad you're seeing your GP. Mine referred me to perinatal mental health services who would have supported me with the request for a section if it had been necessary.

Also, there are good and bad midwives but the good ones are brilliant. You just need to find them, same with consultants.

I'd assumed the tests were the routine antenatal screening like nuchal translucency etc. which you can of course opt not to have.

tipp2chicago Tue 09-Apr-13 10:52:08

It sounds to me like your midwife (for whatever reason) has a vested interest in you having a VBAC. I would be inclined to give her her marching papers and demand your money back as she is not providing the service you paid her for.

Then go to your GP an explain your situation and get her on side.

SoYo Tue 09-Apr-13 10:54:21

You are not having a CS for maternal request. That's the important thing to remember here. You have 2 very valid reasons, you had a section previously for tocophobia & this is still the case & you have now had a previous section. They can encourage you to have a VBAC but cannot force you as the evidence is very equal for risks for both & if you are not planning to have a 3rd pregnancy this is very much the case. Once you discuss your fear of childbirth with them they would be very unlikely to push you towards that option anyway, it certainly wouldn't happen with any of the consultants I've worked for. They will have to tell you risks & benefits of both before signing off on it though. You need to see your GP & book ASAP & ask him for an obstetric referral as soon as possible explaining the severity of the situation etc.

Ladyhawke127 Tue 09-Apr-13 10:56:56

You do not need any more test throughout your pregnancy than an anyone else does, just because you are having a section. I work for the nhs and am really proud to do so. I hope you can find it within you to give them another go.

iwanticecream Tue 09-Apr-13 11:00:40

Thanks, I know the risks well. Didn't have major complications with my first section, but I ended up having it at 36 weeks as I went into labour - DD had breathing probe etc, but I still feel strongly about having another one.

The midwife is obsessed with all the screening bloods - I didn't have them with DD, just the blood group ones, hospital didn't bat an eyelid, they are your choice. She has told me a hospital will not see me without all the other screening bloods, I know from personal experiece that this is utter crap.

She is obsessed with the glucose test as well. Didn't have it the first time, won't be having it this time, fwiw, I have doen my research. Again, she says this is a MUST. It's not.

I am feeling powerless again at the moment and I am begining to wonder if it's all worth it.

iwanticecream Tue 09-Apr-13 11:05:37

With regard to the nice guidelines (as the not so helpful midwife pointed out), they are worded in a way which doesnt give me much hope:

1.2.8.1 Maternal request is not on its own an indication for CS and specific reasons for the request should be explored, discussed and recorded.


1.2.8.2 When a woman requests a CS in the absence of an identifiable reason, the overall benefits and risks of CS compared with vaginal birth should be discussed and recorded.

1.2.8.3 When a woman requests a CS because she has a fear of childbirth, she should be offered counselling (such as cognitive behavioural therapy) to help her to address her fears in a supportive manner, because this results in reduced fear of pain in labour and shorter labour.

1.2.8.4 An individual clinician has the right to decline a request for CS in the absence of an identifiable reason. However the woman’s decision should be respected and she should be offered referral for a second opinion.

I don't want CBT. Fgs, I know what I want, I had one previously.

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