Really painful but no latch problem

[Fluffeh]

Please help. My DD was born by ELCS on Monday morning and feeding was going really well until yesterday. Sometime over night either my nipples got sore or she forgot how to suck without hurting them. We've seen 3 different midwives about it, the infant feeding specialist and the peer supporter but all have said her latch is perfect. She has no tongue tie and is satisfied when done but it hurts me so much I'm having to stop her and swap sides after a few minutes.
Sometimes when I detach her my nipple comes out flattened and bleeding (and bloody painful). I don't want to stop feeding but I'm dreading her getting hungry again soon because I know how much its going to hurt. Please help.

[IsThatTrue]

If your nipple is flattened that's a latch problem. I'm not an expert but I found using nipple shields occasionally during the first few weeks helped as DS had to latch properly and it gave my nipples a bit of a break. Could be worth a try.

[Fluffeh]

Thanks. The infant feeding woman suggested them yesterday so I sent DP out right away to get some but the baby won't tolerate them. She gags, spits and screams when it touches her mouth. I was in tears when they failed too. I know its only a matter of days till my milk comes in but it hurts so much I'm in tears while she's feeding and that makes me feel guilty for making her feel my stress :(.

[Theironfistofarkus]

Mine turned black in the first week. I didn't appear to have a latch issue either - baby kept on putting on weight etc. Keep your nipples permanently moist - you need lansinoh for that. Use nipple shields for some feeds to give your nipples a break but aim to stop using them as soon as things improve. Mine healed after a few days and all was well after that. Your nipples are being subjected to treatment they are not used to. But they will get used to it. May require teeth gritting for a short while though.

[Theironfistofarkus]

Sorry that nipple shields not working. Lansinoh and keeping your nipples exposed to the air is what is needed then. And lots of repeating "this will pass", which it will in a few days time. If it gets too much, don't feel bad about giving a bottle if baby will accept it.

[OrlaKiely]

Only thing I found helped was holding the nipple between two if my fingers - like, clamping it, sort of, to make it stand up enough for the baby to get a good grip on. Otherwise it was a bit like apple bobbing
and make sure it's really in, a long way in.
It does hurt in the first couple of days - shouldn't be bleeding, they can miss tongue tie to do ask for that to be checked again.
Keep going and once milk comes it should ease up xx

[Fluffeh]

I've tried everything I really have. I can't even hand express now because they are so sore. They aren't cracked or dry I've used loads of lasinoh and kept them uncovered since Monday might.
I really don't want to feed my baby formula. I know its not poison, but to me its evil. It's full of fish oils and we are vegetarian. I feel like I've failed her already.

[OrlaKiely]

oh you poor thing.

There may be other formulas which are not full of fish products etc...someone here will know, for sure.

You've not failed. It's bloody hard for most people. Those of us who find it easy are in a minority. If you nix the guilt you'll have more energy to concentrate on taking this one hour at a time, waiting for the milk to come in, it won't be long now.

Not much I can offer in terms of 'help' but a hand to hold if you need it.

[OrlaKiely]

please do get a second opinion on possibly tongue tie

and keep badgering people, anyone, to help with positioning and latch JUST in case. Clearly something is being missed, just not sure what.

BF doesn't hurt THIS much unless something is preventing a proper latch. imo anyway x

[AlbertaCampion]

Hi OP - I was in exactly this position. I am vegetarian too, without latch issues and my right nipple started bleeding on day 5. Pretty frightening when my baby vomited blood! It was painful, but I gritted my teeth and got through it, giving the bleeding boob a miss occasionally to give it a chance to heal. Also expressing out of the affected boob occasionally, which was gentler than the baby sucking and also allowed it to heel.

The best tip I got was from the midwife, who suggested lathering Lansinoh onto a breast pad and keeping it on at all times, to keep the nipple moist.

The other best tip I got (a couple of weeks later) was a packet of Multi-Mam compresses, which I kept on and which worked like magic. You can get them from some branches of Boots, I think.

Lots of teeth-gritting, but I am really pleased that I persevered. I am not saying that you should grit and bear it, if it is too much and you want to switch but FF - but please rest assured that it IS possible to get through it, and that it doesn't last forever!

[20wkbaby]

I had very painful bleeding nipples for 6 to 8 weeks with both my children - good latch, no tongue tie - possibly just very delicate nipples. It was so bad (ended up with mastitis with DD1) that I gave up after 7 weeks with DD1. DD2 would not take a bottle and I ended up bf her for 9 months. Things got better after about 6-8 weeks though. Nipples must have toughened up. I used Lansinoh, and some breast compresses from Mam I think - were soothing if nothing else so maybe a cold compress in your bra might help a bit in between feeds.

I think some people just have more pain than others - I know people who have said they had no trouble at all and I am pleased for them but I think it varies greatly from person to person so don't necessarily feel you are doing something wrong.

[20wkbaby]

X post with Alberta!

[AlbertaCampion]

20wkbaby Fluffeh clearly we are delicate little flowers! Like the Princess and the Pea, but with nipples.

[itsaruddygame]

Fluffeh - sounds like a nightmare. Several MW's at the hosp told me that my latch was fine but a poke around his mouth/my nips From my community MW showed that it was the latch. I also had flattened nipples and a lot of pain and I still have to be careful on the left. I wish I could send you my MW. All I can suggest is trying to push as much of the underside of the aureole into the bottom of the baby's mouth and then sort of flipping the nipple in. It took my an age to get it right but even though my nipples were still a bit sore it was no longer painful.

If you have to stop (believe me I almost did and was just saved by the bell!) then you really should not feel like you failed. There is only so much a person can take and if you go for a good quality formula there is no doubt your baby will thrive and grow.

[DoodleAlley]

I'd second the suggestion to express from sore breasts to give them s break. You'd be surprised how quickly they can mend given the chance- (and lansinoh)

[OrlaKiely]

You can also I believe re-lactate, I mean, stop for a short time and then begin again - don't take my word for it, try the kellymom website, or someone else here may know?

[CorporeSarnie]

OP, is there any way you can get to see a lactation consultant (BF cafe, local LLL or similar)? I know that the midwives have said no latch problem, but in the nicest way possible, if there were no issue with latch you wouldn't be in pain or bleeding. I had some similar issues, MWs were all happy, so I persevered with pain for 3 weeks before finally seeing a lactation consultant at a local BF cafe. She was a godsend, worked me through the 'nipple flick' mentioned by pp above, including how to hold the baby (cross cradle, bottom under elbow tight against you, tease baby's mouth with nipple, then when dd opens WIDE, use arm as a lever to get as much boob as possible into mouth). It sounds weird writing it down.
There is some useful info on Jack Newman's website (here), but it really helps to have real-life expert help looking at you while you're latching and feeding - my local MWs were not able to sort me out unfortunately.
My story ended happily, and we made it though the intial rough phase, but I think this is one of those times where you have to give yourself a bit of a break. Formula is just another way of feeding your baby, and fish oils aren't evil really (I say this as a vegetarian of 20y standing).

[McBaby]

If it hurts there is a problem somewhere. I was told for 8 weeks latch looked great and no tongue tie on multiple occasions! Turns out she had tongue tie and her latch was therefore appalling and she bit throughout her feed.

I also discovered I was allergic to lanolin so plastering I that cream was making nipples more sore. I used multi mam balm and patches (which both became irritating after a couple if weeks use) or vasaline and jelonet - which I found the most healing plus v cheap!

I would find a good lactation consultant who can support you through this difficult abd emotional time.

The best mantra to get methrough is to only think one feed at a time! Otherwise I found it to overwhelming.

[Meringue33]

Lansinoh, or even better:
Express a teeny bit and rub it over your nipple then
Air dry nipples for five mins after a feed.

Do keep looking at videos online and take advice to make sure the latch is as good as can be; I found the "Flipple" and "Sandwich" techniques useful.

I found the pain stopped after about three weeks. It is awful though. Could someone give LO a bottle of ebm or formula just a few times to give you a break? Bf doesn't have to be all or nothing. I ebf'd until 10 weeks, my DP now gives a bottle of ready made formula at 10pm and puts LO to bed allowing me an early night. This has given me the strength to carry on bf'ing the rest of the time, hasn't adversely affected my supply too much and I hope to continue for many months. We use Hipp Organic formula which salves my conscience as (I believe) it is at least organic and ethical (haven't checked if vegetarian).

[enjay0811]

Hi fluffeh,
Baby enjay was born yday mornin and I have blisters on my nipples! MW came today and told me about biological nurturing - it's fab! Still hurts when baby first goes on but the latch feels so much better! Only been doing it today but already baby seems more content and 'full' after a feed. Coupled with lansinoh, I think we'll get thru. Hope things improve for you and baby xx