To not pay for this (long moan)

[mierdo]

I'm a bit cross about this situation...
I'm currently living abroad with the British Forces and have three very close friends back in the UK.
This year we all celebrate an important birthday so my friends got together and decided all four of us should have a city-break together. They didn't consult me on it, just announced this was going to happen.
Even though the break would only cost them £50 each for the flight, and me £200 I agreed as I really wanted to go.
The biggest problem for me, on the allotted weekend was childcare.My husband works an on-call roster and on the dates my friends have booked he can't get a swap so I asked my mum, who was planning to visit us anyway, if she could time her trip over this particular weekend. She agreed.
However, a few weeks ago, she changed her mind, leaving me with the only option of cancelling the trip. None of my friends here locally can childmind and childcare would cost me a fortune on top of the trip itself, so a no-goer.
DH has tried his best to accommodate this but, despite his efforts, cannot help me in any way.
Frankly I'm not a happy bunny and consider myself the victim of a mother who cannot understand the importance of this trip to me and three friends who, frankly, didn't really consider my situation when planning this trip. I had given them a list of weekends which were better suited to me and wouldn't cause the childcare nightmare, but they pressed on with a date which worked for them.
As for the fact, that this trip would cost me more financially for the flight - I would have to have flown back to the UK and then back out, therefore technically putting at least an extra day on my my travels....
Anyway...
received a text today from one of them asking what I was doing about paying for my share of the already booked hotel? The gist of it was "if its non-refundable are you expecting us three to pay?"
I'm so not happy about this, they're hinting I should throw my cash at a quarter share of a hotel I won't even be staying in.
I don't think I should be expected to pay.
The break's not till April.
So, am I being unreasonable to refuse to pay or are they being unreasonable asking for my "share"?

[MaMight]

Oh. Tricky.

Not surprised that you feel miffed about it, but I don't think that your friends and mum are massively at fault either. It would have been nice of your friends to accomodate one of your preferred weekends, but perhaps every weekend threw up a problem for someone?

Why did your mum change her mind about doing you the favour?

I can't decide about payment. If you agreed to go and now can't because your childcare arrangements have fallen through I can see why they wouldn't want to pay extra. You did say you could go on the weekend they chose. It's not their fault you can't now.

Can you re-persuade your mum?

Could they find someone to take your place on the trip?

All a bit unfortunate all round.

[StealthPolarBear]

yes, why did your mum change her mind?

[mierdo]

thanks for your input- no idea why my mum changed her mind, she just decided she didn't want to come over then and the lady's not for turning. It's the kind of thing she does .
I had made it clear to her that the whole trip was reliant on her being able to help out, and at the time she was fine about it. It doesn't seem to bother her in the least that my plans are now ruined.
there won't be a replacement on the trip, it was all about the 4 of us celebrating our birthdays together .
The hotel room will cost them around an extra £50 each, which is about the total extra I would have had to have shelled out for my flights compared to them. That didn't seem to bother them in the least.....

[mierdo]

oh, and my mum thinks nothing of asking me to come over to her when it suits her, and gets in a huff when i can't comply! [double ]

[LibrasBiscuitsOfFortune]

hmm it is tricky and tbh they don't sound very friend like to me however I am going to use the restuarant analogy even if I know the bill is going to be split I still only order the food I can afford to pay for IYSWIM, they should only have booked a hotel they can actually pay for and therefore it's not your problem if they had been more accomodating about your issues then you could have been more flexible about the hotel payment. if they have refused to even try and find a replacement because of birthdays (how old are they 6?) then they are also being obstructive.

[mierdo]

...and another thing......
the text i received from this particular "friend" about the money is the first communication I've received from her since I told them I couldn't do the trip (told them three weeks ago).
Not even a "sorry you can't come...we'll miss you...." etc. Just a "what about the money???"
In fact only one friend even acknowledged my dissapointment.
Out of sight, out of mind......[sigh]

sorry, must stop ranting!

[Pheebe]

If the trips not til April there's plenty of time to cancel the room and for the hotel to resell the date. They might have to stump up a nominal cancellation fee but not the while price of the room. Call the hotel yourself and check. Not sure but it sounded like they weren't sure if they would have to pay anyway.

Personally I would cut my losses, literally and sit back and wait to see how these 'friendships' develop.

[MmeBlueberry]

I've never booked a hotel room where you couldn't cancel up to the check in date.

Tell them to cancel the whole thing and rebook something they can afford.

The lack of sympathy from your friend would put my back up and lack of consultation in general, and I think I am normally quite a reasonable person.

[BelleDameSansMerci]

Completely agree with MmeBlueberry. There is no way that a hotel couldn't accommodate a change and/or cancellation.

If, as I suspect, there are two twin rooms booked it sounds as if your friends don't want to pay for one of them to have a room on their own!

I'm sure they can move to a family room which could accommodate three.

[mierdo]

thanks again, all.
I've emailed the hotel for a quote for a family room, and for availability if they can change the booking.
at least then i'm armed and they can't accuse me of not trying to sort something out.

[notanumber]

Honestly? I would pay it.

Regardless of the ins and outs of whose diaries and commitments needed greater consideration and prority in the planning of the trip, and who has a right to feel slighted etc, no-one held a gun to your head.

You agreed to go on the trip, now you can't go on the trip. The reason you are no longer going - the situation with your mother and the childcare - is not their fault or problem, so the onus should, I think, be on you rather than them to cover the costs of your cancelling.

I know you were cross about their lack of consideration when organising the trip, but that's actually a seperate issue I think.

Put it this way - if you had helped plan the trip and had been happy with all of the arrangements and had been really looking forward it but then you had to suddenly pull out you'd have offered to still pay your share without question, wouldn't you?

You can't punish them for not being as thoughtful and considerate of your circumstances as you'd have wished during the planning stage by now not paying your share because you have to pull out.

Also, you describe them as "very close friends" - you were planning to spend a significant birthday with them. How much of an issue do you actually want to make this?

You are already living in another country to them, so if things turn sour it will not be terribly easy to repair. How much is their friendship worth to you? Are you prepared to sour many years worth of friendship over irritation around a short break that has gone tits up?

Yes, they should perhaps have been more considerate of your location and childcare commitments, but perhaps you should have been firmer on how problematic it would be at the time.

There is clearly already bad feeling on both sides around this. From the tone of the texts they have sent, it seems that perhaps they think you are being difficult - that you shouldn't have agreed to go if it was going to be problematic for you, and now that you've pulled out you're refusing to cover the costs.

It seems to me that your choice is either to pay the money and vow to be more assertive in the future about agreeing to plans that you're really not happy with, and this will all blow over and the friendship will remain.

Or you follow through on your anger and upset with them by witholding the money and things are never the same between the four of you again.

[catwalker]

I agree with other posters - whenever I've booked a hotel (admittedly only in the UK) you give the hotel your credit card details and then have until the day before to cancel. If you just don't turn up, they take the cost of the room from your credit card. But I've never known it not be possible to cancel right up until the last minute.

[Astrid28]

If I understand it all correctly it's just to hotel you still need to pay for, not flights etc so maybe try and think it could be worse? I agree with notanumber and you should pay it as it Isn't their fault that u can't go.

Someone used the analogy of paying a split restaurant bill and them over ordering, but it isn't the same - it's more a case of you placing an order then leaving before the food arrives because your babysitter is ill, and expecting them to pay for it.

I do feel for you and yanbu for being peed off, I would be too, but you're doing the right thing, see what u can salvage money wise, and make sure you do something lovely with your DH and other friends for your special birthday.

[mierdo]

this is definitely more of a moral dilemma and I can see both sides of the argument.
I feel I'm treading a fine line between appeasing some friends and being a total mug, frankly.
Can't help thinking that if the tables were turned, and I'd already paid considerably more for my flights (as I would have had to have done) and then the trip was cancelled for similar reasons, then I wouldn't dream of asking them to subsidise my financial loss.
it's really a toughie

not sure either of the restaurant analogies work - who orders their food two months before they plan to eat it???

[MorrisZapp]

I don't get why you're annoyed to be paying more travel costs than them - presumably that's becuase of where you live.

If a friend and I arranged to meet up somewhere and it cost her more to get there than it did me, I must admit I wouldn't even think about it. If it was going to be too expensive for her I'd expect her to suggest something else, as I would if I couldn't afford to go somewhere.

You seem to be hinting that they should have offered to subsidise your flight, sorry if I have got this wrong.

[spybear]

Seems you are coming to the uk anyway, could you not take your dc's to your mum? You said she expects you to just visit her so presumably you are used to staying with her.

[MrsC2010]

I think if it is genuinely going to cost that much (and there are hotels that charge in advance, if you look on their sites many good hotels will do slightly cheaper rates for pay in advance/no change etc rooms) for you not to go, then yes you should pay. I appreicate it is a pain for you that you can't go, and you feel hurt by their apparent lack of consideration (you may be overhtinking this), but you can't expect them to pay to the tune of £50 each. It isn't their fault, if it was the other way round you'd be hacked off, and rightly so.

[differentnameforthis]

You gave them a list of your preferred dates, seems like they ignored them.

You cancel & the only correspondence you get is about payment for a hotel?

I wouldn't pay! They wouldn't be in this situation if they had gone for a good date for you. I am sure there was a date they could all have done too.

They can easily get a cheaper room/hotel for the 3 of them.

[maxpower]

Agree with astrid28. No matter how convenient or not it was for you, if you said yes to that weekend, you need to cover any losses your friends will make by you not going. However, I would check to make sure the booking can't be changed to another room to save money, but if it can't be changed, I think you'll have to pay up.

Having said that, your 'friends' don't seem to have been very understanding about the situation when they were planning this. They don't seem very 'friendly' to me!

[mierdo]

Morriszap- No I'm not hinting at all that they should subsidise my flight. What annoyed me is the lack of consideration at the extra effort and cost incurred for me to join them, which I was prepared to do had it all worked out. Instead, I didn't get a "sorry you can't make it", just a "what about the money?"...

spybear -sorry- not quite sure where you got the impression I was coming to the uk anyway.
I'm not intending to go to the UK till our planned trip in the summer holidays which is already booked (and organised around my mother's plans!)
It was put to me that I bring the DCs to the UK and did this....very short shrift was given there as you can imagine the cost incurred for that! Plus its school term time then.

MrsC2010- they haven't paid yet, and the booking offers an opportunity to be amended. I'm trying to meet them halfway by finding out about a different sleeping arrangement in the hotel (family room).Not one of them has even mentioned trying this option so they are either spectacularly dim or being obstructive.

[MrsC2010]

Ok, in that case until the situation arises, don't worry. If it turns out it is going to cost them, you'll need to cover this cost.

[notanumber]

mierdo, if the hotel booking can be ammended at no additional cost to your friends and if you (not them) do all the arranging for this, then that seems a reasonable solution.

You're pissed off at them, but your reasons are separate to your obligation to pay your share.

You're angry that:

a) It didn't occur to them that for the trip to happen to happen it would cost you much more than any of them (not really their problem, you could always not go if it was far too pricy, but I agree an acknowledgement of this would have been nice)

b) They didn't make more effort to work around the dates easiest for you as childcare is pretty non-negotiable - either you have it or you can't attend. (Remember that having children does not give you priority for everything though! They might have had similar childcare issues or important work deadlines on the other dates)

c) They don't seem bothered that you can't come, only that they might now have to pay extra for the trip as you haven't been forthcoming with a offer of payment, which is very hurtful. (But try not lose all perspective here - they are "very close friends" and they wanted to go on a birthday celebration trip with you. Of course they care whether or not you're there! Feelings are just running high for all involved)

You're clearly very upset about these issues and only you can decide whether or not there is anything to be gained from voicing your hurt and telling them that you think they were inconsiderate with the planning. Is this a 'tip of the iceberg' situation for you, or a one-off balls-up that's not worth screwing up years of friendship over?

Whatever you decide though, I am of the opinion that you have to pay what you agreed to pay unless you make alternative arrangement that won't inconvenience them or leave them out of pocket.

[madeindevon2]

bottom line - who wants friends like that....

[JustAnotherManicMummy]

How much of the inital arrangements were made by email/text? I suspect most, if not all and so your friends probably don't realise just how much effort you were going to to be there.

The fact you can't now go is not their fault. I think they should try to sort something else out but if you were to make an extra effort and sort the hotel booking I think that would be a nice thing to do.

People are really busy detail with the small details of their own lives and don't always notice the huge efforts others are making. Unless you spelt it out to them very, very plainly I think you're being a bit over-sensitive.

You moved abroad, you have problems with child care. All of these things are very, very difficult for you - but you can't expect people to realise because they will have problems of their own.

Hope you sort it out. And yes, I'd be upset by the text and a phone call would have been more appropriate so you can have a discussion. Bloody text messaging just leads to more problems!

[kansasmum]

Your friends are being unreasonable. You told them the w/e would be difficult but they chose a w/e to suit themselves. You are not cancelling at the last minute and I have stayed in hotels all over the world and even when cancelling with 24hrs notice have never ever been charged.

Your friends don't sound like very good friends- why should you pay?

I think your friends are selfish in the extreme. Tell them to get stuffed!