If we all in this together what cuts have oaps faced?

(273 Posts)
3asAbird Thu 03-Oct-13 12:51:43

As my title says im struggling to see any.

Winter fuel allowance -stays universil-too expensive to means tesrt
same with free bus passes.

part of their social care is paid so they can leave wealth to their families

They excempt from bedroom subsidy so they allowed to under occupy and biggest group.

Pensions I think went up

This new married couples allowance maybe another additional benefit to them if they large proportion of this group.

Housing-they brought at right time probably paid off mortgage and have lots equity.

They moan about interest rates but they fortunate enough to be able to save.

If social-how many homeless pensioners are there? Are they always band a?

Maybe im being harsh and some pensioners have it hard.

But locally they have several holidays a year, holiday homes, brand new cars.

wondering how exactly we all in this together ad should there be mass turnouts under 60 to vote at next general election.

Beastofburden Thu 03-Oct-13 12:59:19

Living on the state pension isn't easy.
They are affected by fuel rises more than most as they are home all day.
They are not usually still saving- they are trying to live off what they saved while they were still working.
Married couples allowance won't do them a lot of good if they are on basic state pension because they don't get enough to pay much tax in the first place.

Rich pensioners aren't in this with the rest of us, but then nor are other rich people. I bet not all the local pensioners have several holidays, cars etc- just the rich ones. Same with loads of equity.

YAB a bit U I think.

emuloc Thu 03-Oct-13 12:59:48

What cuts have those in Goverment faced or ever likely too!

rainsofcastersugar Thu 03-Oct-13 13:00:44

They won't cut much funding that affects pensioners. They are the ones who usually go out and vote.

emuloc Thu 03-Oct-13 13:01:00

In short YABU.

GrendelsMum Thu 03-Oct-13 13:01:37

I wonder whether pensioners may have been hit very hard by interest rates, as you suggested.

The low interest rates and high inflation - which are terrific for people with debts and mortgages - mean that people with savings are effectively losing money each year (each year, their money is worth less and less).

I understand that annuity rates have also dropped very substantially over the last few years, so that people now retiring are getting a much lower income from their pension pot than they would have a few years back.

It's a cliche that we all see people's expenditure and never what they go without, but this applies as much to pensioners as to benefit recipients and their goats.

IamSlave Thu 03-Oct-13 13:02:07

Id rather turn attention off the elderly, the struggling the benefits recipients and turn it back the greed of the city and bankers.

Beastofburden Thu 03-Oct-13 13:03:38

They won't cut much funding that affects pensioners. They are the ones who usually go out and vote.

yes, but they have kids and grandchildfren and so there is not a lot of point bribing them and hoping they dont notice that the rest of their family is shafted.

CissyMeldrum Thu 03-Oct-13 13:04:19

Many pensioners are living in poverty now ,winter is on its way and many will have to make the choice between food or heat, it is awful for everyone but in my view no one is more entitled to help than any other...if you need help you should get it.

3asAbird Thu 03-Oct-13 13:05:23

I just cant think of any direct cuts to them as a group.

Every ones affected by increase in living

energy
petrol
vat
rising inflation.

Maybe I live in particularly affluent area that skews my views

A lot of pensioners I know had ordinary jobs but benefoited from good workplace pensions so many have state work/private.

I know there are rich and poor pensioners,

just they vote more.

if we all in thos together surly cuts should be for everyone not just one age group or families.

GrendelsMum Thu 03-Oct-13 13:06:39

No, I suspect that the low interest rates are effectively a direct cut to pensioners.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

3asAbird Thu 03-Oct-13 13:11:41

yes but its not the government that sets interest rates its bank of England.

What i trying to ask is what cuts have the government made that directly affects pensions as I cant think of any.

Please note I don't hate OAP,S have may friends and family who are in that age bracket.

Not a week goes by in daily mail or express or budget day with how it will affect the poor pensioner.

But in light of the speech yesterday where they singling out specific age group 16-25 is it not worth asking the question.

Forgetfulmog Thu 03-Oct-13 13:13:31

Annuity rates have dropped drastically - both due to the global economy & the EU equal gender directive which came into force last December.

Elderly people can & still do die because they can't afford to keep warm enough in the winter.

Under Cam's gov, the rich are getting richer & the poor poorer.

YABU

Bogeyface Thu 03-Oct-13 13:15:24

I was talking to my mum about this just this morning and she agrees that WFA should be means tested, even though it would mean she lost it.

She and I have no issue with anyone who needs benefits having them, but she said herself that there is a huge population of pensioners who did well on property, worked and saved during the time when you could do that on one wage alone and still support a family and are now on nice private pensions. She is disgusted that the poor are made poorer at the expense of upsetting the Tory voting pensioner massive.

She helps co ordinate food donations through her church to the local food bank and said to me that the number of pensioners they get asking for food you could count on the fingers of one head. It is mainly young families and single people. But they dont vote Tory so fuck 'em hmm sad

3asAbird Thu 03-Oct-13 13:16:06

Yes its very sad that some people cant afford to heat.

Just think we should be holding dave to task.

If I were ed.

I would be saying if we all in this together what cuts has this group faced?

what happened to the big society?

whos hardworking, whos not?

not sure he give answer on any of the above.

LuisSuarezTeeth Thu 03-Oct-13 13:17:32

Much the same could be said of any group. You sound as if you don't like pensioners very much OP.

Bogeyface Thu 03-Oct-13 13:18:01

Under Cam's gov, the rich are getting richer & the poor poorer.

But that is the point that makes the OP NU imo. If say WFA was means tested then it could be increased for those that really do need it, at the expense of those who spend it on holidays (yes, I do know people who do that, my mum is one of them).

There is always an excuse why this would be unworkable, I dont see why they wont be honest and say "Ah well, we dont want to piss off the only sector of society that we can rely upon to vote for us".

Beastofburden Thu 03-Oct-13 13:18:05

I see what you mean, bird . A lot of the cuts are directed at benefits for those of working age, and I think the benefits cap only applies to people of working age. I am not sure how many OAPs get more than the benefits cap in the first place, though.

But the cuts are supposedly designed to reduce the national spending. How much does the government spend on OAPs anyway? apart from the state pension, not a huge amount I think. Housing benefit- they get the same cuts. Disability living allowance- ditto. carers allowance- ditto.

Very rich pensioners will have to pay the higher income tax just like very rich bankers and so forth.

I think perhaps you see the rich pensioners where you live and you are coparing them with poorer younger people. The poorer pensioners are probably less visible but probably even worse off- no chance of training or earning later on, worse health, higher chance of disability...

OldLadyKnowsNothing Thu 03-Oct-13 13:18:15

If you're complaining that OAPs are somehow protected "because they vote" there's a pretty simple answer for the young 'uns. And it's free, and available every few years to everyone aged over 18.

CandidaDoyle Thu 03-Oct-13 13:19:09

Meals on wheels have been scrapped in many areas. I have two elderly grandparents who both live alone and would have benefited from a short daily visit bringing a hot meal. So yabu.

LittleMissWise Thu 03-Oct-13 13:21:32

A lot of pensioners are still on the old married persons tax allowance scheme aren't they?

A lot of sick and disabled people are at home all day and get no help to heat their houses.

I'm getting a bit sick of the fact that the pensioners are being left out of the cuts. Not all of them are skint, not all of them worked hard all their lives. YANBU OP, I'm with you on this one!

SabrinaMulhollandJjones Thu 03-Oct-13 13:21:36

We are absolutely not all in this together - the cuts are disproportionately affecting the poorest and most disadvantaged in society, whatever their age.

I hate what this government has done.

Beastofburden Thu 03-Oct-13 13:22:04

There is an issue with universal benefits like fuel allowance. I felt the same way about Child benefit- I supported taking it away from higher rate tax payers (which included me). I am a bit hmm at the argument that they can manage to cap child benefit for higher earners but not winter fuel allowance.

But on the "who works hardest" thing the OP quotes, that's not relevant to people who are no longer of working age, and wouldbe very harsh on a number of people 16-25 that she is concerned to protect- so that looks like a red herring to me.

juneau Thu 03-Oct-13 13:22:20

Well, I think the main one is that anyone who is retired has to cope on what money they have - whether it's a state pension or a private pension - so the increases in cost of living can have a big impact. Younger people are also affected, of course, but they can get a second job or try to negotiate a pay rise or something to bring in a bit more money.

The pensioners in my family are always moaning about interest rates, but since they all have at least three foreign holidays a year and live in houses much bigger than they need to I'm afraid I nod and smile and have very little sympathy. My Aunt, the worst offender for moaning about interest rates, lives alone in a four bedroom house and is off on safari next month hmm

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