Skint - part 2

[Sleepingbunnies]

AIBU to have switched it off as it gave me such rage to hear that a 21 yr old who has never worked a day in her life had 5 kids, free rent and £1600 on top of her free rent! Knew I shouldn't have started watching it....

[TheOriginalSteamingNit]

You know there is a thread about this: you just posted on it.

You can watch what you like, obviously.

[HoHoHoNoYouDont]

With 5 kids she's going to be too busy or knackered to work!

[HeySoulSister]

'Her' ?? So isn't there a man involved too? Why are you just angry at her?

And where are the jobs for her, or him, in Scunthorpe?

[gordyslovesheep]

that program is nasty

[Doodledumdums]

I don't think you are BU, it made me mad too.

[Sleepingbunnies]

Apologies soulsister I take that back. The pair of them are as bad as each other.

[HeySoulSister]

One if them will be in jobseekers and be actively seeking work

[HoHoHoNoYouDont]

I haven't seen the programme but I wouldn't have wanted five kids at 21.

[pigletmania]

The programme has made me . Do they nt have any pride or integrity. Writing graffiti on the wall, kicking litter in the streets, swearing. Writing on walls in their home, and not taking any resonsibility

[niceguy2]

I'm watching it now on 4OD. It doesn't make me but quite instead.

We've created a society & system where people know their rights but not their responsibilities. A benefit system which gives a family so much money that they are effectively trapped. How does that young family hope to ever get a job which would pay over £2k per month. (£1600 money & then rent on top). And even if they magically could, who'd be stupid enough to work a full month when you can get it from the government?

I've no idea what the answer is though.

[Sparklymommy]

Programmes like this male me very sad. Where is the education for these girls? The 21 year old with 5 kids is the prime example of why people look down on people on benefits. How does she ever expect to be able to give her children the opportunities to better themselves?

However my heart did go out to Jamelia, the 16 year old who had her child removed from her. There was a girl who clearly wanted to better herself, so that she could fight to get her child back. Where was the support and assistance she needed and clearly craved? It appeared to me that she was just expected to get on with it. As a society, would it not have been better in her case to place her in a mother and baby unit? Or even foster care where she could be taught how to take care of the child and encourage to continue her education to give her a better chance of being able to take care of herself and her child? Instead she was living in an appalling "shared" house that looked more like a Doss house with junkies and criminals. Heartbreaking.

[AnnaFiveTowns]

NiceGuy - I do not think that the benefits system gives people so much money that they are trapped. I think the real problem is that many jobs do not pay a living wage ( and that's if you can find one in the first place). We then have this absurd situation where people cannot afford to work. The government keeps harping on about "Making work pay" but they think the solution is to cap benefits, when in fact they need to increase the minimum wage to a living wage.

I have not seen the programme but I would imagine that taking care of 5 kids is much harder that going to work. I find it very sad that a 21 year old has no aspirations other than having loads of kids. I would be inclined to pity her rather than feel angry. And living on benefits cannot be easy. I know how much money we spend annually and it's much, much more than we'd get on benefits and we don't exactly feel flush.

[Beachcombergirl]

The 16 year old Jamilia has had a hard life it looks like. What chance does she have in getting on. She has no family support and no role models to inspire her. Such a sad waste.

[Spice17]

I was being a bit judgy pants about the couple with 5 kids but ended up feeling sorry for her, their DCs are already there (no going back) and they didn't have enough money for food, made me sad. However, I reverted to judgy pants when they decided to spend whatever money they don't have, on getting married.

As for the shouty bloke complaining about the system, why don't you stop moaning and perching at the kitchen sink with a fag, and turn some of your anger into a real desire to find a job.

As for the 16 year old, just felt sad for her, her life looks dire and will probably only get worse :(

[nothingisnothing]

I was, and still am being judgey about the young couple with 5 kids. Sat there crying because they're not going to be getting any payments, watching their 50 inch lcd tv, iphone to the side of her.....
They could sell these, he could set himself up tattooing.....

Felt sorry fo Jamilia though especially when she'd put her best effort into looking good for the courts. The system had failed her in my opinion....Not in taking her daughter away but in giving her the help she needs.

[McNewPants2013]

I didn't watch the programme but if the partner with 5 kids went to work on a minimum wage job, wouldn't they be getting the same amount of money via tax credits

[icklemssunshine1]

Exactly what I said to my DH nothingis! I grew up in poverty but it was proper poverty in the 70s - we had hardly any food & I remember the days of no electricity or water as it was cut off. Luckily I worked hard & as there was a grant system I place I went to uni & got a job that lends me to have a comfortable life. These people say they are "skint" but from what I saw they have more than I did as a child - TV, phone etc. When are people going to learn these items are a luxury & not entitlements? I may have a comfortable life but DH & I never buy things we can't afford. We don't have any form of credit or debt (apart from a mortgage) as I remember my parents arguing constantly over (a lack of) money. We buy second hand whenever we can to also save as well many other money saving methods. Today people think they're "skint" if they haven't got a car or have a holiday. That's not poverty - that's selfishness!

[Ashoething]

Yep moaning about being skint and cadging off a charity when they had a huge tv,2 mobile phones and at least 1 games console that I could see-but never though for one moment off selling them to buy food did they? But of course its not their fault-the poor wee diddums

[Dawndonna]

Ohh, another benefits bashing thread. Whoop de doo!

[ll31]

How is it benefits bashing,to express dismay,despair at jamelias plight, and also to wonder at the life that the 21 yr old and her5 kids will have...

Looks sad all round and no easy answers. Didn't see it all so can't say much

[Ashoething]

Jamelia is a case where she really needed help-very sad. I had no sympathy with the other girl whatsoever-she chose to have 5 kids to 3 different dads and then whinged about being on benefits and expected sympathy. I bet that marriage will last

[wineoclocktimeyet]

I dont honestly know what the anwer is, but what does make me cross is the sense of entitlement people seem to have.

I obviously would never advocate children going hungry or suffering, but I do think if people knew they weren't just going to be given money for their children without having to do anything to earn it themselves, then some families would be much smaller.

[niceguy2]

NiceGuy - I do not think that the benefits system gives people so much money that they are trapped. I think the real problem is that many jobs do not pay a living wage

I couldn't disagree more. The 21yr old yesterday had 5 kids and as a direct result of her choice, the state was paying out £1600 per month and also rent plus whatever other benefits they get.

Even without factoring in their rent, it's the equivalent to a £28k salary. Once you add rent etc they'd need an income of around £35k to break even, let alone be much better off. With 5 kids, one of them will have to be a SAHP so...

Are you saying now that the living wage needs to be around £35k so that this couple can live the lifestyle they've chosen to lead?

Of course not. What we need is a benefit system which discourages further children when you are on benefits. It's a temporary hand out, not a way of life.

[icklemssunshine1]

I don't agreed with benefits-bashing. I grew up in a household where both my parents claimed benefits & I had free dinners etc. I still hold the opinion though if you can't afford it, you shouldn't have it. I grew up in a household with no luxuries as we couldn't afford then (then again it was the early 80s & any mobile phone couldn't actually fit in a house cos of their collosall size :) ).

[EnglishGirlApproximately]

I've been thinking about jamelia a lot today after last nights episode. I don't know how to express what I want to say without sounding like a dick but here goes..

I live in a working class former mining town that used to have a lot of factories and the traditional path for someone leaving school without many qualifications was pit or factory. I grew up thinking this was a bad thing. I was wrong. Entry level jobs now are often shops and call centres and there is an expectation that you need to be able to communicate well, look presentable, be able to use technology to some degree. Someone like Jamelia doesn't have many employment options now. Adding to the problem thousands of graduates applying for the same jobs and it leaves some people with extremely limited opportunities.

I'm not looking down on Jamelia and others like her when I say this, I think its a disaster for the UK that work is so hard to come by for people who aren't academic and who don't get through school easily. Its so easy to sit here and say 'why don't they get a job?' but really, what kind of job are they going to get?

Apologies if that came across as condescending, its not how its meant. Many of my non academic friends left school to do yts schemes or go to factories and have had steady incomes and normal family lives. I feel like that option has gone now for lots of people.