Interesting - Bus Company on wheelchair/Pram spaces..

(1000 Posts)
Bathsheba Tue 01-Jan-13 15:39:53

Yes -that old chestnut.

The Chair of the NCT has posted a letter on her facebook page (and has asked for it to be shared so I doubt any problems with doing this) from a bus company's solicitor - the bus company are being accused of being disabalist in not insisting that parents fold down prams/Get off etc. I've posted the info from the bus company below and will happily post a link to this thread on the facebook page as they have been asked to garner as many opinions as possible.

---------------------

I write further to our recent telephone conversation. As I explained, we are solicitors acting for Arriva North East Limited, which runs bus services in the North East. Arriva is currently involved in a court case brought by a number of disabled passengers. They are alleging that Arriva has discriminated against them because of its policy on use of the wheelchair space by parents with buggies. The court case is very important as it is likely to decide how wheelchair spaces in buses and trains across the UK can be used in future. Arriva’s policy is that drivers will ask parents with buggies to fold them down if a wheelchair user wishes to board the bus, but if parents cannot fold down the buggy or refuse to do so, they will not be forced to. Arriva believes that its policy is in line with the government guidelines and aims to minimise conflicts between passengers by striking a balance between the competing rights of parents with young children and disabled people to use the wheelchair space. The people bringing the claim have proposed various changes to this policy, to ensure that wheelchair users have absolute priority over the space – the proposed changes are listed below. Arriva is obviously concerned about the impact of these proposed changes on parents of young children and their ability to use public transport. Arriva has been given until 28 January 2013 to gather evidence on the potential impacts of these changes. We would be very interested in hearing your members’ views and experiences on the practical impact of the proposed changes on parents of young children. I would be very grateful if your members could respond directly to me with their views by 18 January 2013.

Proposed changes:-

1. Prohibit prams on board
2. Get drivers to ask passengers to fold down their buggies before they board the bus.
3. Get drivers to warn passengers each time they board the bus that they will have to fold their buggies and/or vacate the bus if a wheelchair user wishes to board.
4. Offer passengers with buggies onwards tickets if a wheelchair user wishes to board and buggy cannot be folded down.
5. Refuse access to buggies, prams and pushchairs which cannot be folded.
6. Refuse to continue the bus journey until the passenger with the buggy moves from the wheelchair space.
7. Insist the passenger with the buggy leaves the bus if a wheelchair user wishes to board and buggy cannot be folded down.

Kind regards,
Adam
Adam Hedley
Solicitor
(contact details follow but I thought best to remove them - Bathsheba)

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Wed 02-Jan-13 18:57:15

biscuit

TandB Wed 02-Jan-13 18:57:06

Glitter - I think I may have joined this thread too late for there to be any chance of understanding it.

[sits on hands to avoid asking about the zombie cows]

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Wed 02-Jan-13 18:56:59

wink

TeWiSavesTheDay Wed 02-Jan-13 18:56:43

You aren't going mad. It's all bluster, completely illogical, more fallacies then you can shake a stick at.

It's the fear of north Wales zombie cows that drives it... (if we're feeling charitable)

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Wed 02-Jan-13 18:56:41

grin

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Wed 02-Jan-13 18:56:19

I suggest we all band together and fill the last 8 posts with smilies and bollocks so Offered can't write anymore crap, who's with me?!

13Iggis Wed 02-Jan-13 18:55:58

Maryz - I'm staying out of the country then, don't like the sound of those cows!

Offred Wed 02-Jan-13 18:55:24

It is the lesser of two evils because where i live sometimes you will be expecting a family to get off and miss a hospital appointment and stand in the middle of nowhere somewhere they don't know and are effectively stranded in. Which is dangerous whereas you'd be asking the person in the wheelchair to go home, if there is one space which is already occupied. Not a problem in a city, big problem in rural areas and something which can be avoided by having a pram space but will inevitably happen if there is one multi-use wheelchair space.

Maryz Wed 02-Jan-13 18:54:20

Will someone please reassure me I'm not going mad and tell me to hide this thread grin.

I have the lurgy [cough splutter] and could be playing fun games on my new ipad instead.

[sigh].

So you struggled with it too crashdoll but now you have managed to deconstruct it, I wish I was still in blissful ignorance. angry

Moooooooooo
Zombie cow with BSE alert

Maryz Wed 02-Jan-13 18:52:45

No it wasn't. It was about people not moving out of a wheelchair space. The posts before were all about your double buggy being unfoldable.

The "suck it up" post was for wheelchair users who couldn't get on. And your first reason for them not being able to get on was an unfoldable buggy.

You need to read your own posts, you know.

5madthings Wed 02-Jan-13 18:52:19

Numerous timrs i have gone to.get on the bus when there is slready a pushchair on it and i fold mine up, simples.

No matter how many times you read it, this Offred classic makes no sense.

"How is that relevant. Women who are entitled are protected just like disabled people who are entitled (wheelchair users or not) are protected yes, the protection is for simply being disadvantaged not because people might morally deserve it." confused

TeWiSavesTheDay Wed 02-Jan-13 18:50:30

I'm telling you high/drunk/infected by zombie cows.

Only answer.

crashdoll Wed 02-Jan-13 18:50:24

Women who are entitled are protected just like disabled people who are entitled (wheelchair users or not) are protected yes, the protection is for simply being disadvantaged not because people might morally deserve it.

I've sat and read this entire thread (fuming at many posts) and just had to reply to this.

1.) Nice snipe that wheelchair users are entitled for wanting to use wheelchair not fucking 'multi-use' space.
2.) Women are not protected. All people are protected against gender discrimination under the EA 2010. Being a female (unlike having a disability) is not a protected characteristic.

To those who have argued entitledly and generally, just been prattish ---- I'm sick to the fucking back teeth of labelling disabled people and shoving us in a group. Yeah, I'm disabled but I also am a mature student, someone's best friend, a brunette with wild curls, a terrible singer, addicted to BBQ pringles, a person who loves to be outside in the summer rain. I am a HUMAN BEING and health is not a given. One day, you may find yourself in a wheelchair and I hope you are shown more compassion than you have shown others.

Offred Wed 02-Jan-13 18:50:07

Ah ok it was about what happens when a wheelchair user wants to get on the bus that already has a wheelchair, but i did make a similar comment about what happens if pushchairs want to get on an occupied pushchair space.

Maryz Wed 02-Jan-13 18:48:07

"Offred Wed 02-Jan-13 10:43:02
That is just how it is Mary, I assume people fold if they can to make enough room. If I was in a none folding wheelchair I wouldn't ask someone to fold their folding wheelchair so I could get on, I'd assume if they could do they would have done it.

I don't see it as any different to buses getting too full to allow any passengers at all or regularly just not turning up, that's just how it is for everyone using buses, you can't guarantee you'll fit. A disabled person may already be in the space another disabled person wants to use, it is easier to replan a journey from the start of it, you can't have a competition about who needs it more at the bus stop you just have to suck it up.

That's why I cycle now, there was a short time when I had no option but to use a bus."

[baffled]

Oh I think anyone reading this will know who the knoboid is.

But she might HAEMMORHAGE, kungfu. If she has to fold a buggy she'll bleed all over the seats and diiiiiiiiie

Binkybix Wed 02-Jan-13 18:47:06

This thread is about enforcing people's rights to the wheelchair space (hint: this means people in wheelchairs, not mums with prams).

Its not about kicking people with prams off buses unless that's unavoidable (ie they can't or won't fold). If you don't want it to be unavoidable try campaigning for pram spaces, rather than taking away people's ability to use their rightful wheelchair space.

Maryz Wed 02-Jan-13 18:47:03

Glitter, there is one advantage to this type of thread - surely someone, just one person, will be reading it and have a lightbulb moment which might lead to them folding their pushchair next time?

13Iggis, I think it's probably less of a problem in a city because there will be another bus in a few minutes. In the country, with only a bus an hour (and lots of scary cattle hmm) it is much more of an issue.

Offred Wed 02-Jan-13 18:46:36

No, it wasn't in my 10.43 post Mary btw, if you look.

Amytheflag Wed 02-Jan-13 18:46:30

Do you know what? I think Offred has won the award for the biggest wind up I've seen on here in my shortish time as a member. No one can honestly be this repetitive, ignorant and disablist. I refuse to believe it lol.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Wed 02-Jan-13 18:45:56

Oh Offered, give it up! Stop carping at me specifically, when others have pointed how off some of your comments have been.

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