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Allergies and intolerances

Just seen G.P. re.ds3's eczema & bamboozled by what he told me!!Advice please?

21 replies

rascals · 13/10/2006 12:34

My ds3 has regularly been seeing G.P re. his eczema (every 1 or 2 mths.) trying to get it under control with various creams,emollients etc.
Today I mentioned to him about dairy foods & have heard of some kids having success cutting out dairy foods/products in diet & seeing an improvement in their eczema.
As my ds1 had/has allergies & eczema & lot of this in genes throughout family G.P said this might be worth trying.
Anyway the thing(s) that are confusing me are:
(& I thought I knew a fair bit cos of ds1's allergies!)
G.P has said I should try him back on formula milk he used to be on before he reached age 1 & was able to take ord. cows milk.(btw ds3 is 17mths old.)I said would that be cutting out dairy though because I thought there was an element of cows milk in formula milks like aptamil,sma etc.,though obviously not in soya formulas like wysoy etc.He said there wasn't any cows milk at all in baby formula that's why you give it to babies until they are 1 so that they don't get cows milk till then.But I thought & I'm sure at some point I checked with H.V re. this you don't give baby cows milk till they are 1 cos there is not enough nutrients in it for them before they reach 1.
Then he said all babies should now be on formula till 18mths,not 12mths ,that was the new approach.Again I thought I had checked this out & was sure it was still 12mths.
Finally I said if cutting out all dairy & prodocts containing dairy in ds3's diet does work & it helps his eczema then if he's not having any dairy in diet what about his calcium requirements or protein because he is only 17mths. would he not need calcium supplements or something to help with development etc. he said even if all dairy cut from diet I don't need to substitute it with anything or give him supplements cos as long as hes getting varied diet & plenty fruit & veg. he will be fine.
I find this strange as ds1 has been on calcium supplemts for years cos he can't have any dairy!& also though fruit & veg. are def. needed in diet I didn;t think they were abundant source of calcium or protein!
ANYWAY SO SORRY ITS SO LONG ,aNY ADVICE,KNOWLEDGE WOULD BE much appreciated.Thanks

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Anchovy · 13/10/2006 12:50

I think that is quite different to what I was told. Can't really comment on all bits but happy to pass on what we were told. I very much like and trust my GP by the way.

My DD was diagnosed with fairly serious eczema at 4 months and we had to go completely dairy free. I breastfed for a bit on a dairyfree diet but when she went to formula she went onto Wysoy. At the stage at which you would switch from formula to ordinary milk (can't for the life of me remember when!), she went onto carton soya milk, but we were told that she should have the calcium enriched stuff and that that was quite important.

We found that she could tolerate goat's milk better and started using that when she was about 18 months in cooking - never could quite give it to her to drink, always seemed a bit goaty. The doctor said he was prepared to be open-minded but the goat's milk was structurally similar to cow's milk, whereas soy milk wasn't, and though not reacting to goat's milk may be a sign that she was growing out of it.

Dd gave up drinking milk quite early on, but would eat a lot of those alpro soy fruit yoghurts.

The good news is that she was 3 last week and it has completely gone - has been for about the last year. (Doctor predicted it would disappear at 1, 2 or 5 I seem to remember) From being an extremely scrappy looking baby with cracked and bleeding cheeks she is now quite possibly the loveliest looking 3 year old in the world!

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brimfull · 13/10/2006 13:04

like anchovy's my ds has now outgrown his excema (still holding out for the asthma to go).We were never told to give up dairy and he had skin prick tests for dairy allergy (done when his nut allergy was diagnosed)which was negative.
However when he was 2 I switched from bottles to cups and ds refused from then on to drink milk and his excema almost disappeared .
I was told by dietician to keep feeding him cheese to up his calcium so he still gets dairy from that.I was also told that he didn't need a calcium supplement.

As for the formula not having cows milk in it? I thought it had as I'm sure that's what caused ds's dry skin from a very young age as I tandem bottle and breast fed him.
Have you looked at the ingredients on the tin.Maybe worth a phone call to the formula milk company.

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rascals · 13/10/2006 13:30

Hi,
Thanks for replies,ggirl re. eczema going when he cut back milk ,you said you continued to give him cheese ?Was his skin still better even though he had cheese/dairy in cheese didn't aggravate eczema?
Cos my ds3 does like cheese now & again & that would be good to know I could still give him that maybe.

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Anchovy · 13/10/2006 13:46

One thing I was told was the "rawer" the milk, the more likely it was to cause problems. Thus cream is the worst, then milk, then cheese, then yoghurt (I think that is the right way round for cheese and yoghurt). Basically any "treatment" of the milk changes the allergen profile (look, I knoe this is really badly explained, but I'm sure you get my drift).

Certainly in our case cream would bring DD out in a rash very quickly, and she was able to tolerate cheese earlier than milk.

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PinkTulips · 13/10/2006 14:45

Formula does have milk in it. read the back of the packet, all of them are made up of mostly dried skimmed milk. I know because dd is intolerant and it brings her out in eczemaic patches and when the shops didn't have goats milk last year I checked every single formula pack in the hopes on of them didn't have milk in it. Also, when I first realised at 7 months that the dairy in her diet was causing it I cut out everything but formula first, and it didn't go away. It didn't clear until I stopped the formula too and went back to 100% BM.

dd is 20 months now and has been on goats? milk as her main milk drink since 12 months and eats goats? yogurts. she rarely has a flare up and all of these can be linked to milk in her food.

it's still 12 months, although formula companies would try and convince people otherwise if they could.

it?s possible to get enough calcium in a diet without dairy as long as he's eating lots of green leafy vegetables, oranges and if possible foods with added calcium in them, no need for supplements unless he won't eat these foods.

try your ds on the goats milk for a while to see does it improve, goats milk has properties beneficial to eczema in its own right so even if you ds isn't dairy intolerant (although with ds1's history he probably is) it could still help him.

HTH

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MumRum · 13/10/2006 15:07

baby formula definately has dairy produce in it! your doctor has been seriously misinformed!
My son had really bad excema as a baby and was dairy free from 4 months of age...
He is now 8 and we saw a dietitian recently for the first time in 6 years.

This is from a leaflet she gave me

Apparently a child aged 1 - 3 years old needs 350mg of calcium a day.
1 whole orange has 100mg of calcium
1 slice of white bread has 40g
kingsmill calcium white has 168mg per slice
tropicana calcium enriched orange juice has 260 per glass
calcium enriched soya milk has 200mg per glass
soya yoghurt has 150 per pot

beware though, I'm sure you know, dairy is in practally everything

Good luck...

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rascals · 13/10/2006 20:47

Thanks folks for all your info.& advice,
esp.mumrum for those calcium figures.
BTW,forgot to say G.P has given me eumovate ointment(clobetasone o.o5%) to try(hydrocort 1% not really doing anything for ds3's eczema & he said to try this eumovate for 5 DAYS only as its quite strong,to see if any diff. with eczema,before I go down the dairy free route.
Anyone any success stories with eumovate cream?

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gigwig · 13/10/2006 20:53

We've used eumovate on DS when younger to help clear bad excema - it is really really strong used it for short periods. DS skin now really clear - he is 3.

DS had calcium syrup supplement till he was 2.5 then we were told no longer needed it as the diet provided all calcium needs.

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CastsSpellsWitchySpells · 13/10/2006 21:03

As I think you've now gathered, formula milk does contain cows milk protein. You can either use soya milk, or if GP wants him on formula then he will need to prescribe something like Nutramigen (hydrolysed formula used for dairy intolerant babies). You might find it difficult to convince him to drink it though, as it smells and tastes quite odd, and obviously having had cows milk now he will know the difference.

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MumRum · 13/10/2006 21:06

Your welcome ...
I haven't used eumovate cream although I know your not supposed to put it on your face though...

how old is your other DS1, who is on calcium tablets... Do you get the chance to see a dietitian with him at all? is he 100% dairy free?

My son has Tesco's soya milk which is fortified with calcium and vitamins but IIRC it wasn't/isn't recommended to children under 2 as a main drink so my son had wysoy...

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MacdogOnElmStreet · 13/10/2006 21:09

i have long term excema.
while pg i didn't want to use steroid creams so looked for an alternative.
the best i found for me was Medihoney cream
medihoney website this is available in chemists and some health shops(eg holland&barrat)
it made a big difference to my cracked and infected skin
hope this info helps

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brimfull · 13/10/2006 21:09

yes rascals he tolerates cheese and occassionally milky porridge without his excema coming back.

good luck with you little one.

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VickiB · 13/10/2006 22:12

My 8m old daughter has just come up with a exzema type rash all over & her lymph glands are swollen on her neck. The doctor prescribed Fucidin (which did nothing) and then eumovate, which seems to be working. My DD1 (4 ys) has excema and asthma and I was worried that we were going down the same old road. I was also worried as the baby possets alot.... and as the reflux should be getting better now rather than worse... I wondered whether it was dairy? All this seems to have flared up since she's gone onto 3 meals a day - with yoghurts / cheese / butter etc. etc. Anyway - the doctor suggested a 2 weeks dairy free trial to see if things improve. I've got the SMA Lactose Free milk & will give her soya yoghurts etc.
Has anyone else gone through a similar thing?

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VickiB · 13/10/2006 22:13

Obviously for exzema read eczema. Its late!

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CastsSpellsWitchySpells · 14/10/2006 07:57

Vicki - you are aware that children can be intolerant/allergic to cows milk protein, and not just lactose aren't you? Although I'm not familiar with SMA lactose free milk, other lactose free ones still contain CMP, so I'd check on this, as it's not a dairy free diet at all if it does have it.

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BudaBeast · 14/10/2006 08:12

My DS is now 5 but had excema and I was advised to cut out dairy too. We did and it really cleared up - he has grown out of it totally now.

We were living in Bulgaria at the time and were prescribed Nestle Nan formula which is hypo-allergenic apparently - certainly worked for us. I cut out all other dairy and used goats cheese and he was fine.

Gradually reintroduced dairy starting with chees (although he had had come cheese along the way) and it was fine.

Agree that the more processed dairy is the less is likely to be an allergen.

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VeniVidiVickiQV · 14/10/2006 08:15

It is usually the cows milk protein that causes the problem, rather lactose.

The difference between cows milk proteins and sheeps and goats milk proteins is, as was explained to me, something to do with the size of the protein molecules - cows milk ones are larger and therefore the gut and body finds them much more difficult to contend with.

Im sure someone will be along in a minute to clarify that though.

Standard formula milk DOES have cows milk derivatives in it. Not sure why the GP said this wasnt the case. However, it isnt the same as just drinking cows milk fresh from the fridge because formula has been designed for babies to digest and has various additives that are believed to be beneficial, and more on a par with breast milk.

The current recommendations are no cows milk before 12 months.

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hauntymandy · 14/10/2006 08:17

I was told years ago that people cut out dairy as its one of the easiest to do but mainly it isnt the problem!! It wasnt in my DS.
Try one thing at a time, cut it out for 10 days then reintroduce to see if there is a reaction.
Ds's 'bad foods' were citrus, tomatoes and fish.
Watch the creams they give you as some have fish oils in and some citric acid!!

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MumRum · 14/10/2006 18:37

when you say you cut out dairy.. do you mean you go completely dairy free or do you still give your children biscuits, breads, sausages, ham etc with dairy/milk in.

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CastsSpellsWitchySpells · 14/10/2006 18:56

DD and I (still breastfeeding) have cut out dairy completely, but that's due to milk intolerance, rather than eczema related.

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VickiB · 15/10/2006 22:53

Arrrgghhhh. Now i'm COMPLETELY confused! The SMA LF DOES contain CMP so back to square 1 there then.
Thanks for everyones advice!

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